White Flight! (away from 3rd World)

[kimba1]

that kinda confirms my statement that Asians in the united statesare undereducated. the area of education that is missing is the arts and I`m pretty sure Germany teaches thier students that subject more than the students here in the U.S.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Most graduates from German public high schools speak at least one language other than German, usually English, fluently. They generally know about as much after 12 years as Americans do after completing an AA degree.

The US wastes far too much time and money on competitive sports for the very small minority (nearly all male) that play them. American schools generally have classes only 180 days per year, while in Western Europe and Japan, at least another 30 days are spent in classes, and the school day is longer. Most of these countries have NATIONAL standards, whereas in the US local school boards generally set the standards, if any. In the US, we do not prepare students for specific careers. Vocational studies are reserved for the "dummies", while a number of careers that are greatly needed (automotive electronics is a good example) require a deeper knowledge of match and sciences than revered careers like management and law.   

[Plane]

  Why is a national standard in Europe different than a state standard in the US?

    Texas or California or Florida are fully  large and populous enough to qualify as  Countries on a European scale.

[Christians4LessGvt]

Germany is over 90% German by ethnicity/race.

If Germany had the level of poor uneducated illegals invading
that they had to educate their results may be different.

[kimba1]

it is true most American Asian American student tend to be bi-lingual due to after-school studies.  I also chaulk the decline to a common inclination for people to cut courses. Pretty much I hear people talking about cutting subject for a student never adding. common rational is it`s a waste of time. I often hear people complain kids should not learn any language but English. but I don`t notice the removal of it has help strengthen other studies.

not sure about germanies illegals but the majority of the labor I see there is not german and money is very tight their.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Germany is over 90% German by ethnicity/race.

If Germany had the level of poor uneducated illegals invading
that they had to educate their results may be different.

======================================================
There are thousands of schools in the US in which the students are well over 90% White Americans, and they still graduate knowing far less than graduates of German schools. 

[kimba1]

even today I still hear people say thiers no need to learn history ,eng lit. or any of the elective courses. so to complain about education is to focus on the wrong people to solve this.

[Xavier_Onassis]

People say stupid shit because they are simply stupid.

Stupidity, unlike ignorance, is incurable.

Alll knowledge is superior to all ignorance.

[kimba1]

not arguing about that just pointing out such statement is a indicator how lacking of support education has in America. I say people are more willing to leave than fix education. I even go as far to say abandon the student who have no choice but take said subpar education. which is why we`re weak in the STEM subjects

xo, I do take exception to you calling vocational school as reserved for dummies. I truly believe we`re in no position call people who pursue such things dummies. we should be glad people are willing to learn period.

[Christians4LessGvt]

xo, I do take exception to you calling vocational school as reserved for dummies.

If XO said that, yes it was a very stupid statement.
Plumbers, electricians, HVAC, and other skilled careers can be quite rewarding financially.

[kimba1]

I haven't seen it in the news but in my area the demand for such skills is in a all time high. It's actually having an effect on the construction industry. Lets just say more unsafe shortcuts.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Vocational school should clearly NOT be reserved for dummies. The fact is that school counselors treat it that way far too often. "He's not college material, send him to vocational school." This is a common attitude in the US. It is not a common attitude in Germany, where the trades are thought of as descended from the guilds. 

American society could clearly get along with fewer lawyers. A paralegal with a computer could do at least 90% of the work lawyers do better than most lawyers.
We could not do so well with fewer plumbers, carpenters or electricians. But most of what young people learn of these skills they learn on the job, not at public school.

In my high school, the vocational skills available were wood shop and metal shop for the boys and home ec (cooking, mostly) and stenography for the girls.

There were no classes that dealt with electrical work or mechanics at all.

[Plane]

All in all , an unusual example of across the board agreement, and a point well made.

xo, I do take exception to you calling vocational school as reserved for dummies.

If XO said that, yes it was a very stupid statement.
Plumbers, electricians, HVAC, and other skilled careers can be quite rewarding financially.

I haven't seen it in the news but in my area the demand for such skills is in a all time high. It's actually having an effect on the construction industry. Lets just say more unsafe shortcuts.

Vocational school should clearly NOT be reserved for dummies. The fact is that school counselors treat it that way far too often. "He's not college material, send him to vocational school." This is a common attitude in the US. It is not a common attitude in Germany, where the trades are thought of as descended from the guilds. 

American society could clearly get along with fewer lawyers. A paralegal with a computer could do at least 90% of the work lawyers do better than most lawyers.
We could not do so well with fewer plumbers, carpenters or electricians. But most of what young people learn of these skills they learn on the job, not at public school.

In my high school, the vocational skills available were wood shop and metal shop for the boys and home ec (cooking, mostly) and stenography for the girls.

There were no classes that dealt with electrical work or mechanics at all.

[kimba1]

hmm

awhile back a flashlight broke and i found out nobody in the room knew even the very basics to fix it by themselves. last october my costume was tony stack with a flashing arc reator. nobody understood how I was able to connect a battery to the light source.

I see a even greater shortage of such skills in our near future.

[Xavier_Onassis]

I am all for greatly improving vocational education in this country.

Every individual has a different set of abilities. The ideal is to match up people who have needed abilities with education and careers that allow them to be, as the old Army slogan said "all that you can be". There are some jobs that probably no one wants until they realize that they can make a decent career of them. Two that come to mind are (1) buying live shrimp from shrimpers, and small, live shrimp around to bait stores and (2) pumping out septic tanks. There is a woman here in Miami who has developed a great talent for doing mosaics of house numbers to design into the stucco on houses. They are really quite beautiful.  She did one for her own house, and another two for neighbors, and one of her jobs got in to local paper and now it is her career.  Certainly more useful to society than dealing faro in a casino or bartending... not that there is anything wrong with that.