Georgia?s Defeat and America?s Options

[Plane]

<<Yes he [Lenin] did [say so], and it was an accurate observation [that Russia was the prison of nations], when did it become untrue?>>

It became untrue with the triumph of the Bolshevik Revolution. 

No , I asked when the prison of nations observation became untrue , not when there was a change of jailor.
Remember it was here that you learned that Lenin had this complaint , you mistook it for Natzi propaganda , the diffrence being so stubtle.

After WWII, Russia had to establish a protective belt around itself and guard against the emergence of fascism in the former Axis countries, like Hungary and East Germany, that it defeated and occupied, so it kept a tight anti-fascist lid on them.  Poland was in the same boat, although they were our Allies, they were fanatical anti-Semites, right-wing fascists and militarists and also needed a tight lid kept on them.  The U.S.S.R. was not a "prison of nations" after WWII, but OTOH, was not about to permit the rise of new fascist and anti-Soviet regimes in the lands it had recently conquered.  It did not need to face new attacks from the West, and there was also a requirement to extract payment for reparations from the former Axis satellite countries that it occupied.  They never really repaid the U.S.S.R. for the terrible damage they caused, but the Russians had to be there to ensure that the country's wealth was being sent in the right direction.  But really, at the end of the day, it was mostly the fascists and the anti-Semites who suffered under Russian hegemony.

That to me soulds like a prison of even more nations.

Asking reparations of Poland and Chezoslovica? I hadn't even considered this rediculous idea.

[BT]

They demand reparations and we do the Marshall Plan.

I can see how that would make us the bad guys.

[Michael Tee]

<<That to me soulds like a prison of even more nations.

<<Asking reparations of Poland and Chezoslovica? I hadn't even considered this rediculous idea.>>

There is an obvious misunderstanding here.  The U.S.S.R. never asked for reparations from Poland or Czechoslovakia.  I certainly never claimed that.  Poland got plenty, including lots of land, from Germany and its Axis allies, and I would expect that Czechoslovakia did as well, but that's a more complex issue because Slovakia declared its independence under Father Joseph Tiso, an RCC priest, and joined forces with Hitler's Germany.  After the war, Father Tiso and his priestly associates were hanged by the Czechoslovakian government without much delay, but not before they had managed to exterminate almost the entire Jewish population of Slovakia.  Individual Slovak collaborators were dealt with without mercy.  But I'm not sure whether or not the general population were forced to pay reparations.  Probably not, since there was a very active Slovak Resistance movement, whose Communist leaders were part of the post-war Czechoslovakian governments.

<<They demand reparations and we do the Marshall Plan.>>

Maybe because the Nazis and their allies didn't destroy very much of the U.S. material infrastructure.  Maybe because you turned on your Soviet Allies and decided to buy yourselves some friends real quick.

[Plane]

Stalin ws faithfull to our freindship?

[Michael Tee]

<<Stalin ws faithfull to our freindship?>>

Absolutely - - he stood by while the British army crushed the Greek Communist Resistance in 1944 while hostilities were still going on and he never tried to fuck with the pro-Western government that they installed there.  And the French Communists accepted posts in the post-War regimes and ordered (from Moscow through Thorez) the Communist wing of the French Resistance to lay down their arms and stop executing Vichy collaborators.

The problem was, the U.S., French and British governments were hostile to the U.S.S.R. before the war, and never lost that hostility.  Stalin probably never really trusted their good intentions, but because of the enormous public goodwill manifested for the U.S.S.R. during the war, was careful not to give the capitalist powers an overt reason for displaying their hostility.  What he maybe didn't realize was that they didn't NEED an overt reason, because they can easily manufacture all the reasons they wish, and the corporate-owned mass media will simply follow along and spread it.

[Plane]

<<Stalin ws faithfull to our freindship?>>

Absolutely - - he stood by while the British army crushed the Greek Communist Resistance in 1944 while hostilities were still going on and he never tried to fuck with the pro-Western government that they installed there.  And the French Communists accepted posts in the post-War regimes and ordered (from Moscow through Thorez) the Communist wing of the French Resistance to lay down their arms and stop executing Vichy collaborators.

The problem was, the U.S., French and British governments were hostile to the U.S.S.R. before the war, and never lost that hostility.  Stalin probably never really trusted their good intentions, but because of the enormous public goodwill manifested for the U.S.S.R. during the war, was careful not to give the capitalist powers an overt reason for displaying their hostility.  What he maybe didn't realize was that they didn't NEED an overt reason, because they can easily manufacture all the reasons they wish, and the corporate-owned mass media will simply follow along and spread it.

So that whole Iron curtain thing was just a nasty roumor that Winston Chirchill started?