Like FDR - Thiswill Be One of Our Most Beloved Pres

[The_Professor]

One guy calling another guy "cute". We are INDEED in the Obama era already.   

[sirs]

You sure did have to dig deep into your pile of RW manure to come up with Taft-Hartley rolling back some of the Wagner Act which actually made your hated big govt more powerful. The combination of big govt and big business is a major characteristic of  fascism.

I did not say I was a fan of Taft-Hartly. And I know already about partnership between corporations and government being a part of fascism. I frequently speak out against that sort of partnering. Recently I've opposed the government bailouts of corporations for that very reason.

Ironically, that NOW is the current path I see the government beginning to take, with the tact of putting Government in the controling seat of so many private industries, be it banks, lending institutions, housing, automobiles, and soon heatlhcare.  And who are the folks that keep trying to lay claim as Bush the fascist??

If you want to lecture me about crafting an argument and what is intelligent, you are going to have to step up your game. A lot.

I don't think anyone's going to hold their breath

[Xavier_Onassis]

Ayn Rand is not the beginning and end of libertarian thought. As I recall, she didn't like libertarians.

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What exactly is the difference between Rand's Objectivism and Libertarianism, other than maybe Rand being more in favor of smoking cigarettes?

[Universe Prince]

The only reason I even deal with an irrelevancy sauch as you is that you are so cute when you are angry. You can spout your silly circular bullshit forever.

I'm not angry. And the fact that you never produce even a single substantive argument against what I say only makes your shallowness all the more obvious.

[Universe Prince]

What exactly is the difference between Rand's Objectivism and Libertarianism, other than maybe Rand being more in favor of smoking cigarettes?

Primarily and basically, Rand's Objectivism is a moralistic, absolutist philosophy. For Rand, there was no room for dissent or disagreement with her ideas, even when she applied these ideas to art. There was what she liked and everything else was worthless. What she believed, according to her, was rational and everything else was irrational. And one of the resulting flaws of her philosophy is that it would work great so long as everyone was superhumanly strong, healthy and smart, and in complete agreement with her. It is, essentially an authoritarian philosophy that would require authoritarian efforts. Libertarianism, generally speaking, not only doesn't require everyone to adhere to a single philosophy, some would argue it forms the basis for a practical anarchy, the opposite of authoritarianism. Which, I think, is one reason why Rand didn't like libertarianism.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Rand was very close to the Hegelian direct opposite reaction to Russian Leninism of the 1920's. Her book "We the Living"  shows how the major figure changes from being a revolutionary to being an anti-revolutionary. It's the only book she wrote where you could actually identify in some way with the major character. After that, her characters tend to molt into angels and demons.

In her other books, the characters are diametric opposites, like Superman and Lex Luthor. The good guys in Atlas Shrugged are only lacking capes.

[Knutey]

The only reason I even deal with an irrelevancy sauch as you is that you are so cute when you are angry. You can spout your silly circular bullshit forever.

I'm not angry. And the fact that you never produce even a single substantive argument against what I say only makes your shallowness all the more obvious.

There really is no point in providing a "substantive " arguement to you. You,  likeShlaes, are a pseudo-intellect who starts from your own shallow set of assumptions and then finds dubious "evidence' to support those views.No one can ever "prove " anything different to y'all. A real thinker has a mind that is searching for the truth. Not one that has already found it no matter how silly it is.

[Universe Prince]

Yes, Knute, a real thinker has a mind that is searching for truth. But a real thinker also needs more than the insubstantial fluff and insults that you try to pass off as arguments to be persuaded. A real thinker needs this exactly because he is searching for truth, not superficial assertions. You accuse me of being a pseudo-intellect to whom no one can prove anything, but you haven't tried to prove anything at all. Your dismissal of Shlaes is at best flimsy and immaterial. Your dismissal of the CFR with the assertion that "Dick Cheney was its director for a couple of years" is, at best, a distortion. When pressed, you simply avoid addressing the issue and make excuses. You're hardly marking out the intellectual high ground. In point of fact, Knute, you are a fraud. You're trying to pretend to be an intellectual, a thinker who cares about finding the truth, when in actuality all you ever do is run away from the truth and insult anyone who disagrees with you.

[Universe Prince]

In her other books, the characters are diametric opposites, like Superman and Lex Luthor. The good guys in Atlas Shrugged are only lacking capes.

That is a flaw in The Fountainhead and Atlas Shrugged. She wrote in terms of absolutes. But then, that was her intention, particularly in Atlas Shrugged. It is a novelization of her philosophy.

[Xavier_Onassis]

That is a flaw in The Fountainhead and Atlas Shrugged. She wrote in terms of absolutes. But then, that was her intention, particularly in Atlas Shrugged. It is a novelization of her philosophy.

I could not agree more. I doubt that one could write good fiction and good philosophy in the same novel. I can only think of the mysterious B. Traven (who wrote The Treasure of the Sierra Madre) which is sort of anarchist, and perhaps some of the novels of Jack London and  Vicente Blasco Ibáñez, also anarcho-syndicalists and and an Argentine Catholic Fascist writer known as Hugo Wast who managed to write entertaining noels with a political viewpoint. All of these were more of less contemporary with Rand.

All of them were much better writers than Rand, because their characters had human characteristics as well as political viewpoints.