Author Topic: When you really don't need a tan.  (Read 1867 times)

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Plane

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When you really don't need a tan.
« on: October 28, 2012, 03:28:44 PM »
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Plane

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2012, 03:38:17 PM »
The culture diffrence between modern Islam and the modern west is not all that wide .

Check out the suits our grandmothers wore to the beach.

Their grandmothers didn't go to the beach.


  How much would our Great grandfathers have been alarmed to see what a few decades of women earning doctorates and voteing would do to their beloved society?

  Well, not just in the Islamic world , but in all the world that is not directly in contact with the west , this change is happening without the decades of getting used to it that it took for us.

  They have to be worried that we are infectious.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2012, 04:40:53 PM »
The violent reaction to Western culture in the Muslim world is largely due to the fact that it is obvious that their ancient and rather backward culture is being overwhelmed by that of the West.

As late as the 1950's. it was illegal to sell condoms in several states. I think Connecticut was the last holdout. I worked in a drugstore in the 1950's and early 1960's, and all the condoms were in the back, under the pharmacist's worktable. Customers had a dozen names for them, and only whispered what they wanted. You knew what they wanted because they whispered something and had this frightened look on their faces.

The other way to buy them was in machines in the Mens room at truckstops. There were poorly designed vending machines that always took your money, but did not always result in anything coming out.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2012, 05:07:57 PM »
Yes , you get my point exactly.

I think they mistake "Future Shock" for "Crusade" and think that they have to react in panic.

What we are presenting to them would have been very shocking to our recent ancestors , but we got used to it in the space of a few decades.

Too bad this is killing people , it could be very amusing if it didn't include so much death.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2012, 05:17:42 PM »
We had a couple of idiots speak about a noble Crusade and some others, including a general, denounce Muhammad. There are still a lot of nutcases in the US who are sure that the prophesies of Revelations will come true, and Jesus is returning. That is what set a lot of them off when Juniorbush mongered the Iraq War. After the invasion, the GOP sent a bunch of loonietunes NeoCons over to totally transform Iraq. They even planned to give them a new flag.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2012, 05:50:54 AM »
"Crusade " doesn't mean anything that "Jhaid " doesn't also mean, and that is part of the trouble, when we get in the habit of tagging a noble fight with the name "Crusade" we are acting ignorant of how poorly it translates in cultures where "crusade" means "people who talk strange languages are coming to kill you" but this is recipocal with "Jhaid " also.

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2012, 09:38:26 AM »
it's always dangerous when someone marches ahead of others by 50, 75, 100 years or more.
the cavemen would be pissed as shit right now!
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2012, 05:51:04 PM »
Crusade meant the war to drive the Muslims from the Holy Land to prepare for the return of Jesus, which was supposed to happen 1000 years after the crucifixion.

Jihad does not mean that at all. Just look it up, why don't you.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2012, 05:52:11 PM »
x
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2012, 05:47:58 PM »
Crusade meant the war to drive the Muslims from the Holy Land to prepare for the return of Jesus, which was supposed to happen 1000 years after the crucifixion.

Jihad does not mean that at all. Just look it up, why don't you.

They mean exactly the same thing if you are on the recieveing end.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2012, 11:50:44 PM »
No,they don't.

Just look it up.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2012, 06:09:38 PM »
No,they don't.

Just look it up.

I decide what words mean when I hear them.

Doesn't everyone?

Agencys that standardise words are aids to understanding , but they do little to generate meaning a lexicographer documents the meaning that he finds the word serving. Ropes are named by sailors , military maneuvers are named by generals, Klins are named by potters.

Invasions are named by invaders and by invaded.

Crusade means the noble struggle , Jhiad means the noble struggle , to invaders.


Crusade means the bloody invasion , Jhiad means the bloody invasion , to invaded.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2012, 07:29:38 PM »
There is a difference between a war of offense, like the Crusaders trying to take back the "Holy Land",and a war of defense, trying to defend one's home.

Look up jihad. It does not mean the same thing.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2012, 04:25:13 AM »
I don't think you have looked up.

You don't suppose that when the Mongols took over India in years of bloody conquest and enslavement , that they didn't call it Jhiad?

Sometimes we call it a Crusade when a newspaper takes on a corrupt city hall, or a whistleblowing individual exposes a lawbreaking polluter. It is our word for noble struggle . I think this is the result of the medievel Popes propaganda.

If you bare ever on the receiveing end of Jhaid , you will understand what I mean.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: When you really don't need a tan.
« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2012, 01:37:14 PM »
It means "justifiable war". The debatable part of the justification, of which many are possible. No one wants to claim that they started a war in order to rape, pillage and burn, since these are activities frowned upon by all the Sand People religions, so they invent excuses. But a Crusade originally referred to a specific act of aggression with a specific purpose in a specific place, and the word jihad did not mean that. A crusade always refers to some sort of preemptive action, never a defensive one.

Al Qaeda is  defending a past way of life that is increasingly threatened economically. socially, politically and morally, and is certainly doomed in the long run. Technology is rendering it obsolete and will continue to do so. The same is happening with the fundie Christians. They are doomed as well. Islam will survive, just as Christianity will survive, but the fanatical element is doomed in both cases.

Both words are used metaphorically, but jihad can refer to an act of defense, while the word crusade always refers to some sort of attack.

The Crusades were not a noble struggle in reality. Only those who are ignorant of the various Crusades would call it noble in any way. Establishing the County of Edessa was not a noble venture, just an act of unjustifiable aggression. Jerusalem was not improved by the Crusaders, nor did putting the Holy Land in Christian hands result in Jesus gratefully returning to claim the throne as suggested in the Book of Revelation.

The actual Crusades were a miserable and bloody flop. I expect that Al Qaeda's jihad will be a less prolonged, and less justifiable flop.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."