Belief Is the Least Part of Faith

[Plane]

Buddhism says that to live a better life, you should act in a way that is logical.

Oh?


Example of this?

[Plane]

The four stages of attainment [edit]

The Sangha of the Tathagata's disciples (Ariya Sangha) can be described as including four or eight kinds of individuals. There are four [groups of noble disciples] when path and fruit are taken as pairs, and eight groups of individuals, when each path and fruit are taken separately:
(1) the path to stream-entry; (2) the fruition of stream-entry;
(3) the path to once-returning; (4) the fruition of once-returning;
(5) the path to non-returning; (6) the fruition of non-returning;
(7) the path to arahantship; ( the fruition of arahantship.


Stream-enterer [edit]
Main article: Sot?panna
The first stage is that of Sot?panna (Pali; Sanskrit: Srot?panna), literally meaning "one who enters (?padyate) the stream (sotas)," with the stream being the supermundane Noble Eightfold Path regarded as the highest Dharma. The stream-enterer is also said to have "opened the eye of the Dharma" (dhammacakkhu, Sanskrit: dharmacak?us).
A stream-enterer reaches arahantship within seven rebirths upon opening the eye of the Dharma.
Due to the fact that the stream-enterer has attained an intuitive grasp of Buddhist doctrine (samyagd???i or samm?di??hi, "right view") and has complete confidence or Saddha in the Three Jewels: Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha, that individual will not be reborn in any plane lower than the human (animal, preta, or in hell).


Once-returner [edit]
Main article: Sakadagami
The second stage is that of the Sakad?g?m? (Sanskrit: Sak?d?g?min), literally meaning "one who once (sak?t) comes (?gacchati)". The once-returner will at most return to the human world one more time. Both the stream-enterer and the once-returner have abandoned the first three fetters. The stream-enterer and once-returner are distinguished by the fact that the once-returner has weakened lust, hate, and delusion to a greater degree. The once-returner therefore has fewer than seven rebirths. They may take place in higher planes but will include rebirth in the human world at most only once more. Once-returners do not have only one more rebirth, as the name suggests, for that may not even be said with certainty about the non-returner who can take multiple rebirths in the five "Pure Abodes".

Non-returner [edit]
Main article: An?g?mi

The third stage is that of the An?g?m? (Sanskrit: An?g?min), literally meaning "one who does not (an-) come (?gacchati)". The non-returner, having overcome sensuality, does not return to human world, or any unfortunate world lower than that after death. Instead, non-returners are reborn in one of the five special worlds in R?padh?tu called the ?uddh?v?sa worlds, or "Pure Abodes", and there attain Nirv??a; P?li: Nibbana; some of them are reborn a second time in a higher world of the Pure Abodes.
An An?g?m? has abandoned the five lower fetters, out of ten total fetters, that bind beings to the cycle of rebirth. An An?g?m? is well advanced.
Arahant [edit]
Main article:

Arahant

The fourth stage is that of Arahant, a fully awakened person. He has abandoned all ten fetters and, upon death (Sanskrit: Parinirv??a, P?li: Parinibb?na) will never be reborn in any plane or world, having wholly escaped sa?s?ra.[6] An Arahant had attained awakening by following the path given by the Buddha. In Theravada the term Buddha is reserved for Siddartha Gautama Buddha, as being the one who discovered the path by himself.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_stages_of_enlightenment

I could be wrong about this , but these belifs seem to be teachings of faith , not things determined scientificly.

[BSB]

"but these belifs seem to be teachings of faith , not things determined scientificly."

Plane, those teachings are 2500 years old. Of course they weren't determined scientifically. Those were put up to show that originally Buddhism was related to the next life in many ways just as Christianity was/is. Some still hold those beliefs but most practicing Buddhist I know do not. They are more concerned with using the Buddha's teachings the way XO explained. To curtail suffering in this life.

BSB

[Plane]

That might be a simularity then, because Christianity is better for coping with suffering than it is for having no suffering.


But was the Buddah thinking that Buddism was related to getting off the wheel, or was his belief more modern?


If Bhuddism has developed away from its origion, and improved, that wpould be a diffrence, better Christianity would be closer to Christ.

[BSB]

What makes you think Buddhism has moved away from its origins?

What makes you think that no suffering means you no longer suffer?


BSB

[Xavier_Onassis]

Buddhism has not moved away from Buddha's teachings. What has happened is that it has been added to in various ways by various sects through the years.

Christianity has done the same. Jesus preached to Jews, not Gentiles. Paul was the one that decided that Gentiles should be a part of the movement.

[BSB]

You can't transfer Buddhism from one society to another without adapting it to the society it was transferred to. Buddhism has to grow up through a society vertically rather than just moving horizontally from one culture to another. It won't work if it doesn't adapt. For example: If you're an American and you try to do Guru Meditation using the Tibetan Guru Padmasambhava as the focal point how the hell would you relate? You couldn't relate. What do we know about Padmasambhava?


BSB 

[Plane]

What makes you think Buddhism has moved away from its origins?

What makes you think that no suffering means you no longer suffer?


BSB

I may ha

"but these belifs seem to be teachings of faith , not things determined scientificly."

Plane, those teachings are 2500 years old. Of course they weren't determined scientifically. Those were put up to show that originally Buddhism was related to the next life in many ways just as Christianity was/is. Some still hold those beliefs but most practicing Buddhist I know do not. They are morev concerned with using the Buddha's teachings the way XO explained. To curtail suffering in this life.

BSB

  I may have poorly interpreted your earlyer post.

I think you have poorly interpreted mine also, suffering is truely inescapable, a good relationship with God is good for coping with suffering.

Job suffered a lot , but acnoledged Gods right to take away what he had given, King Soloman suffered little adversity, but got pretty depressed anyhow.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Job was a victim and a bit of a putz. The entire story is clearly just a myth. There never was any Job, just like there never was any Adam or Eve.

[BSB]

"suffering is truely inescapable"

That's what I said. However that doesn't mean you can't stop suffering.

BSB

[Plane]

"suffering is truely inescapable"

That's what I said. However that doesn't mean you can't stop suffering.

BSB

Sounds like heaven.

[BSB]

To suffer is one thing however that doesn't mean you have to suffer over it.

BSB

[Plane]

To suffer is one thing however that doesn't mean you have to suffer over it.

BSB

May I pretend that I understood that?

[BSB]

The problem with life is that to live it you have to be born. That's the tax. Everything follows from that. Sickness, old age, death. If we weren't totally interdependent with everything else in this universe there wouldn't be sickness, old age, and death. If everything was independent, there wouldn't be change. But that's not the way it is. So if you learn to accept the tax, and not raise its cost by your actions, you will find that a life already broken is a life as it has to be, and you will no longer suffer over suffering.

BSB

[Plane]

The problem with life is that to live it you have to be born. That's the tax. Everything follows from that. Sickness, old age, death. If we weren't totally interdependent with everything else in this universe there wouldn't be sickness, old age, and death. If everything was independent, there wouldn't be change. But that's not the way it is. So if you learn to accept the tax, and not raise its cost by your actions, you will find that a life already broken is a life as it has to be, and you will no longer suffer over suffering.

BSB

If I understand your statement aright , then you must be fundamentally incorrect, dependance and independance is moot as reguards decay. Stars decay , rocks decay , energy dissapates and systems ,whether closed or open, just run down.

Or I may have misunderstood , I never know when I misunderstand , tho there have been times when I have realised later.