The origin of Batman

[Universe Prince]

Over at another internet forum where I usually only lurk, there is a post that has a couple of articles explaining how Batman's inspiration was not Zorro, as commonly thought, but The Shadow. Apparently the link is so direct that several of Batman's early stories were lifted directly from plots of The Shadow novels. If you're interested in learning more, here is the link:
http://forums.nightly.net/index.php?showtopic=52497

[sirs]

I wonder what the death of Heath Ledger will do with the next Batman movie release date?  Likely will bring about more pople wanting to see it, that may have not otherwise     

[kimba1]

the 1st movie nicholson slamdunk that role
and was smart enough to get more money than the cost of the movie through merchandising.
ledger will most likely do a great job
I have never heard of any actor not like doing villians
it`s the most fun and expressive to play
denzel loves playing bad guys
heroes are boring to do

[sirs]

John Malkovich makes a GREAT bad guy, whether its in something like Dangerous Liasons, to In the Line of Fire.  Con Air was a tad over the top even for him, but still, GREAT bad guy

[kimba1]

billy zane made a great devil in demon knight
I think i remember the villians more than the heroes
once upon a time in the west
henry fonda played a cold blooded killer

[yellow_crane]

John Malkovich makes a GREAT bad guy, whether its in something like Dangerous Liasons, to In the Line of Fire.  Con Air was a tad over the top even for him, but still, GREAT bad guy

Malkovich would have made a great actor in the Greek theatre.

He is the one who doesn't need a big white mask.

[Brassmask]

I remember waiting for Batman in 1989 or whenever it was.

It was a collision of several of my favorite things.  Comics meets Tim Burton meets Batman meets Jack Nicholson meets PRINCE.  It was great.

However, I felt that there was too much Jack Nicholson and not enough Joker. 

There were two other actors that were at the top of the list to play Joker that I think would have been much better:  Willem Dafoe and a younger, leaner Ray Liotta.

Liotta was fresh out of his turn in Something Wild.

Both had perfect features for Joker that could have been accentuated.

Unfortunately, Nicholson was an HUGE Batman fan, Prince fan and MONEY fan and knew the film was going to make millions and threw his weight around.

The one thing I don't like about Batman movie is the way the costume designers and production designers don't really understand his costume.  They always want it to be armor with the cowl as a helmet and military boots.

That ain't Batman.

Batman is a guy in a cloth costume with lots of tiny little toys.

[Brassmask]

Oh yeah. 

I really like the Christian Bale thing.  I'm hoping for a lot with the new one.

I hope that Ledger's performance is great but I'm afraid that they have tried to make him too "real".  I don't want him to be just a psychotic with a stained and mauled face. 

Joker's the result of psychosis, yes, but his has materialized and is expressed in a very gleeful manner.

[sirs]

I really don't think anyone can top Nicholson's joker.  IMHO

[kimba1]

brass
i think Link you batman deadend awhile back it had the guy wear the grey adam west costume
I actually works and that short was shaming the major studios to do better
google batman deadend for the vid
if i didn`t link it before
my firewall is stopping me

[Brassmask]

I really don't think anyone can top Nicholson's joker.  IMHO

Wow, totally unrelated to the topic but I instantly hit reply on this as soon as I saw it was from you, sirs and I started typing "I used to think that no one could top..." but I couldn't think of a finish for the sentence and I realized that I just wanted to continue my assertion that Nicholson wasn't that great (which it wasn't bad but it wasn't that great either, he was way too fat) only because it was you and you dared to disagree with me.

Little epiphanies, huh?

I imagine that you never really read comics and if you did, you haven't in the last twenty years so you probably aren't aware of the development of the Joker in the comics.  Rather than belittle you, let me offer you some education on the subject and see what you think.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joker_(comics)

If you are really feeling daring, perhaps you might venture to your local comics shop and pick up the graphic novel by Alan Moore (one of if not the greatest writer of comics) and artist Brian Bolland called The Killing Joke.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman:_The_Killing_Joke

Even for a non-comics reader, it is a wonderful tale.

[sirs]

Well, I appreciate the sincerity of your response, Brass.  No, I've never really been a comics reader, and my assessment is based purely on the acting, and not on how consistent or fluid he was supposed to be to the comics version.  That said, thanks for the informative insight on your perceptions of both Nicholson's joker, and that of the realm of comics in general.  It's appreciated     

[Brassmask]

Well, I appreciate the sincerity of your response, Brass.  No, I've never really been a comics reader, and my assessment is based purely on the acting, and not on how consistent or fluid he was supposed to be to the comics version.  That said, thanks for the informative insight on your perceptions of both Nicholson's joker, and that of the realm of comics in general.  It's appreciated     

NP

[Universe Prince]

I wonder what the death of Heath Ledger will do with the next Batman movie release date?

That is still up in the air. I think there are probably negotiations with Ledger's family about that.

John Malkovich makes a GREAT bad guy,

About 10 years ago he would have made an excellent Joker or Riddler. (I would like to have seen him as the Riddler.) He's a bit old for the parts now, imo, unless someone turns Frank Miller's Dark Knight graphic novels into movies.

I really don't think anyone can top Nicholson's joker.  IMHO

Possibly, but equal, certainly. And Ledger was just the guy to do it.

The only two villains I really hope Christopher Nolan decides to tackle in his Batman films are two with which he is unlikely to bother. Lady Shiva and Grant Morrison's creation, Prometheus. I confess I don't know that much about Prometheus, but Grant Morrison described him as the anti-Batman, and I would like to see what Nolan would do with that idea. Lady Shiva, well, I like the idea of seeing Batman in conflict someone with equal or superior fighting skills and I like the character. She is a bit mysterious, and she has a sort of moral ambiguity that could make for an interesting character on film.

[kimba1]

but who to play shiva?
it has to be somebody who has enough ability to look superior .
jet li did that in alot of his movies
remember lethal weapon4 he fougfht somebody with one hand.
shiva hardly has any equals in the comics
in fact she trained batman
hardly batman`s equal
maybe michelle yeoh
but I can`t think of anybody good enough
if  done it more likely be lucy liu
blecch