Author Topic: Islam, Slavery and Rape  (Read 2593 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Richpo64

  • Guest
Islam, Slavery and Rape
« on: November 23, 2007, 11:41:59 AM »
Islam, Slavery and Rape    
By Jamie Glazov
FrontPageMagazine.com | Friday, November 23, 2007


Frontpage Interview?s guest today is Bill Warner, the director of the Center for the Study of Political Islam (CSPI) and spokesman for politicalislam.com. CSPI?s goal is to teach the doctrine of political Islam through its books and it has produced an eleven book series on political Islam. Mr. Warner did not write the CSPI series, but he acts as the agent for a group of scholars who are the authors. The Center?s latest book is The Submission of Women and Slaves, Islamic Duality.


FP: Bill Warner, welcome back to Frontpage Magazine. This is the second part in our two-part series with you on the Center?s most recent book. In the first part we discussed Islam and its doctrine on the submission of women. In this second and final part we will discuss the matter of slavery. Welcome to Frontpage Interview.


Warner: It is a pleasure to work with Frontpage.


FP: So tell us in general where Islam stands on slavery.


Warner: Islam?s stand on slavery is based on its political principles of submission and duality. The principle of submission could not be clearer. By definition a slave is the most submissive of all people. You become a slave only when you have no more choices. A slave has completely submitted to a master.


The principle of duality is shown by the fact that Islam does not enslave Muslims, only kafirs (non-Muslims). Since only kafirs are enslaved, it assures that more of the world submits to Islam.
Islamic slavery is based on the Trilogy of the Koran, the Sira (Mohammed?s life) and the Hadith (the Traditions of Mohammed). All three texts say that slavery is permitted, ethical, desirable and a virtue. There is not one single negative word about slavery.

Slavery is seen as a process that brings kafirs to Islam. It is a virtue to free slaves, but Mohammed only freed slaves who submitted to Islam. If the kafir slave does not submit, then their children will. So given enough time, slaves convert to Islam. That is one of the reasons that Islam sees slavery as a positive.

Of course, there is another reason that Islam sees slavery as being so "good" and that is the money. Mohammed and the other jihadists made a fortune out of enslaving kafirs. Mohammed used the money for more jihad. So slavery financed the spread of Islam and jihad from the beginning.


FP: What were the ingredients of Mohammed?s own life in terms of slavery?


Warner: Mohammed is the perfect pattern for all humanity and his life was saturated in slavery. When his mother died, it was a freed slave who nursed him. His first wife owned slaves. One of his first converts was a slave. His closest friend, Abu Bakr, traded one of his black kafir slaves for a Muslim who was enslaved by a kafir.


But all of this was small change compared to his envolvement with slavery once he turned to jihad. In his first major battle at Badr, he stood by and prayed as his henchmen beat and tortured captured slaves to get information about the enemy kafirs.


Slaves made Mohammed's pulpit. Slaves mended his cloths, cooked his food, and did every thing that a slave does for the master. He gave away slaves as gifts and received them as gifts. He went to war to kill the males so that the remaining people would surrender to be sold as slaves. Mohammed sold slaves on both the retail and wholesale markets.


He offered captured slaves their freedom if they would first agree that he was the prophet of Allah. A kafir slave then became a slave of Allah, because all Muslims are slaves of Allah. For a slave, the religion of Mohammed started and ended with slavery.


FP: Can you talk a bit about Islam and sexual slavery?


Warner: All morality in Islam is patterned after the example of Mohammed. Everything that he did and said defines what is permitted or ?good?. Mohammed repeatedly sanctioned forced sex (rape) with kafir females after they were captured. The Hadith clearly reports that he got first choice of the women. In one case, he repeatedly demanded one particular woman for himself and swapped two other kafir slave women for his choice. So if Mohammed was involved in the rape of kafirs, then rape is a virtue, not a sin or error.


When Mohammed destroyed the B. Qurayza tribe, all of the adult male Jews were beheaded, so that no husbands were left. Mohammed then took the children and gave them to Muslims to raise as Muslims and he sold off the Jewish women as slaves.


We know from another story that the women were divided into sex slaves and domestic slaves. In one scene, a jihadist is trying to obtain a high ransom for a woman and he is told that her breasts are flat and her mouth is cold, so her value was less. In short, she was only good for work around the house, not in the bedroom.


The Hadith tells of another story where the Muslims used coitus interruptus to avoid impregnating the kafir sex slaves. The reason was purely for business. If the kafir sex slave was pregnant, then she was worth less money.


Islamic doctrine says that kafir women should not be used for prostitutes, only for the pleasure of the master.


When Mohammed attacked the Jews at Khaybar, many moral precedents were set. Sexual slavery received an entire set of rules. Muslims were not to rape pregnant or menstruating women until they had delivered the child or finished their periods. At Khaybar, Mohammed?s god Allah, announced that even married women were fair game for rape.


Mohammed only killed some of the Jews at Khaybar. The male and female survivors were needed to work the land as dhimmis. (The original dhimmis were semi-slaves with no civil rights. Today, dhimmis are ignorant kafirs who apologize for Islam.) Since Islam needed the men to work, husbands were left alive. That was the reason that the Koran said that in this case, even with the husbands looking on, it was good to rape the women.


Sexual slavery was not only fun and profitable for the Muslim men, but rape was a powerful tactic of war, then and today. The women are forced into submission to Muslim men and the husbands are humiliated. Humiliated men are weakened men, so more kafirs were less able to resist Islam.


For some time Mohammed's favorite sex partner was a Christian slave from Egypt named Mary. One of Mohammed's wives caught him in some state of intimacy with Mary in the wife's bedroom and raised hell. Mohammed promised to not do it again and moved Mary to her own apartment in Medina.


Mohammed had received Mary and her sister as gifts. He gave her sister away to a Muslim poet. He was used to giving away sex slaves. He gave several of his top lieutenants kafir sex slaves. Umar, who later became caliph, gave his sex slave to his son. [As an aside, when he was caliph, his son got drunk and Umar beat him to death.]


FP: This institution of Islamic sexual slavery isn?t just a reality of the past is it?


Warner: Everything that has been said up to now is not only history; it is Sunna (the example of the perfect pattern of action and morality found in Mohammed). So today we don't have a beautiful blonde Christian girl on the block in Mecca, but we have continuous and ongoing rapes by Muslims in kafir cities. This goes on everywhere that Islam goes because it is Sunna.


This is a continuous 1400-year history of jihad. In every detailed history that comes from the original documents from history, rape is a constant. You have to look in the original documents, since our historians refuse to report it in so-called history books.


Rape is Sunna. Rape is not a sin. Rape is permitted and encouraged by Mohammed and the Koran. Islam is the only political system in the world that includes rules for rape and war. Rape is jihad. How good can it get? A Muslim gets to rape a kafir girl and get heaven credits. All jihad is a ticket to Paradise.


The most disgusting aspect of the Islamic rape of kafirs is not the rapes, but the kafir response. Kafirs become dhimmis by ignoring the rapes. I challenge you to find one, even one, mention of Islamic rape in the history books.


Islamic rape is more taboo than the N-word in the media. At least the N-word is acknowledged to exist. Even unicorns exist in media fantasy. But Islamic rape is forbidden to even exist as a fantasy.


And to reach a fevered rant: our so-called "feminist" scholars are absolutely intellectually and morally bankrupt hypocrites. They are traitors to our culture and a shame and a disgrace. They remain silent in the face of heinous crimes against women. They are arch-dhimmis when they refuse to speak of the Sunna, history and current rapes of our daughters, mothers, and sisters.


And our tax dollars support their evil in our public universities.


FP: Mohammed was a white man and had black slaves, correct? Isn?t there a racism here? Where is all the leftist indignation against Islam on this issue?


Warner: The relationship between blacks and slavery is ironic. A standard approach of Islam to blacks is that Christianity is the religion of the white man and Islam is the natural religion of the black man. They add that Mohammed's second convert was a black slave, Bilal, who was Mohammed's companion and the first muezzin (the man who calls to prayer).


The Hadith, however, goes out of its way, many times, to tell the world that Mohammed was a white man. The Hadith also tells us the race of the kafirs that Mohammed enslaved. And Mohammed had many black slaves in his household. One of his slaves was a black man called, Anjasha.


Mohammed owned black slaves. It is that simple. His favorite wife, the child Aisha, had a black slave. But to be fair to Mohammed, he was not a racist about slavery. He enslaved Arabs, Africans, and Greeks. Islam enslaves all kafirs, independent of race.


Mohammed was politically incorrect about blacks and called them "raisin heads" in the Hadith. Thus it would be a compliment to call a black Muslim a "raisin head." It would be Sunna and not offensive. Mohammed also said that Muslims are to obey the Islamic leader, "even if they were black." A left-handed compliment, at best.


Mohammed used his robe to shield Aisha, so she could watch black slaves perform a martial arts routine in the mosque. The Hadith tells of a prophecy about a black man bringing evil to Islam. Black men were prophesized to destroy the Kabah.


But when Muslims preach to blacks they only say that Islam's first muezzin was a black man. They don't tell the rest of the story.


FP: Can you give us a brief synopsis of the history of Islamic slavery?


Warner: It all started with Mohammed and then went worldwide.


When Islam burst out of Arabia into the kafir world, they took the wealth and slaves. Slavery was an unapologetic part of jihad.


The Arabic language is a good place to see how important slavery was. In The Submission of Women and Slaves, we collected over 30 Arabic words that deal with slavery. We think that Arabic has more words for slaves than any other language.

Both a black African and a black slave have the same name, abd. The historical reason for this is that African slavery was so important to Islamic economics. Language reflects history. Islamic legal history is filled with the complaints by African Muslim jurists about how Arabic Muslim slave traders captured African Muslims and sold them on the auction block.


History records around 11,000,000 Africans being sent to the Americas and about 13,000,000 being sent to Islamic countries for a total of 24,000,000 African slaves. To get one slave, many others have to be killed for the tribe to surrender to enslavement. The old, sick and children are left behind to starve. These collateral deaths are conservatively estimated to about 5 to 1. So that implies that over 1400 years, 120,000,000 million Africans have been killed to furnish Islam with its profits.


The accepted history of race in the U.S. is that white men captured Africans, brought them to the U.S. and sold them as slaves. This is wrong. When the white slavers showed up on the west coast of Africa, they didn?t capture Africans. They looked them over in the pens, gave the Muslim slave traders their money, took their bills of sale, and loaded their purchases into their boats.


The Muslims had been plying the trade of war, capture, enslavement, and sale for a thousand years. Mohammed was a slave trader. Long after the white slave traders quit, the Muslims continued their African slave trade. It still exists today.


And to put a fine point on it, many African slaves were castrated by removing both testicles and penis. Castrated slaves brought more on the slave block. Castrated blacks were the traditional keepers of Mohammed's mosque in Medina.


African slaves were called abd; white slaves were called mamluk. Most black slaves were used in mining and heavy fieldwork. White slaves were used more for skilled trades. White slaves were even promoted to leadership positions, if they converted. Only one black slave was promoted to leadership. He ruled Egypt and was a eunuch.


Over a million white slaves were taken from Europe. Our word, slave, comes from Slav. A white woman was the highest price slave for 1400 years on the Meccan auction block. The Muslim who could not afford a white sex slave choose an Ethiopian woman at a third of the price.


The most revolting enslavement of whites was how Turkish Muslims took as a tax, one out of five Christian children in Islamic ruled Eastern Europe. These male children were taken back to Turkey where they became the janissaries, elite soldiers for the sultan. The Turkish sultans did not trust tribal Muslims to be the elite palace guards, since they all harbored ancient tribal rivalries. We see the same distrust of Muslim tribal politics in Afghanistan, where kafirs are used as presidential guards.


The Hindus were enslaved, but we don't have the number. We do know that jihad took half of ancient Hindustan and killed 80,000,000 Hindus. We have accountings of Hindus being enslaved by the hundreds of thousands at a time.


Muslims enslave everyone, but no one enslaves Muslims. This knowledge is part of Islam's arrogance and superiority. They know the history; it is the dhimmis (kafir apologists) who are ignorant of the doctrine and history of Islamic slavery.


FP: The violent capture and enslavement of black Africans by Muslim Arabs continues to this today. The root of this modern-day slavery is, of course, Islamic doctrine.


Warner: The enslavement of Africans is happening today. The only reason that Islam stopped enslaving whites and Hindus is that Islam is too weak to resist the social pressure. The Sunna of slavery has not changed, just the ability to use their law.


In the African countryside Muslims are still using jihad to enrich themselves. I have spoken with a Sudanese slave who escaped. The Muslims killed his parents and took him and his sister. Each night the jihadists gang raped his sister. Remember, rape is Sunna.


When he met his new masters, they put him in the middle of a circle of the family and each beat him with a stick. He was told that his new name was Abd, black slave. He slept in the barn with the animals.


Our media and intellectuals are quick to punish the slightest insult by a white against a black man, but they have not the slightest recognition of murder, rape and enslavement of blacks by Islam. Our media and intellectuals are dhimmis.


FP: Final thoughts and comments?


Warner: Slavery is the fruit of Islamic duality. Mohammed, the master of dualism and submission, used slavery as a tool of jihad because it worked. Mohammed?s life was infused with slavery. Slaves were the lifeblood of Islam. Mohammed, the white man, owned both male and female black slaves. His attitude was pure dualism.


The most disgusting thing about Islamic slavery is not that Muslims enslave others, but that we ignore it. The Muslims have been fed the Koran and the Sunna in their mother's milk. They are doing what is ethical according to Islam. In a strange way, Muslims are to be pitied. A Muslim is the first victim of Islam.


The criticism of whites because of their being involved in slavery is standard fair in the media and the universities. Try to find a university that even teaches about the killing of 120,000,000 Africans for Muslims to profit from the 24,000,000 slaves.


Blacks define themselves on the basis of slavery. They will not go beyond the white, Christian version of slavery. There is only one theory of history in the black community?the West African Limited Edition version of history. Blacks will not admit the broad scope of slave history. Hindu slavery? It never happened. White and European slavery? It never happened. Slavery on the East coast of Africa? It never happened. A massive slave trade through the Sahara into North Africa? It never happened. Black, eunuchs at the Medina mosque? It never happened. This incomplete history of slavery is what the taxpayers fund in the state universities.


How can black leaders ignore Islam's sacred violence in Africa? Why aren?t the black columnists, writers, professors, or ministers speaking out? They are ignorant and in total denial. They are the molested children of Islam.


Blacks are dhimmis and serve Islam with their silence. There is a deep fear of Islam that makes them overlook and placate Islam. Arabs are the masters of blacks.


One thing whites and blacks have in common is that their ancestors were enslaved by Islam, and both are too ignorant to know it. Blacks and whites have a secret shame buried under the denial of being slaves inside Islam.


But the rest of the media and intellectuals line up as dhimmis, too. One of the marks of a dhimmi under the fourth caliph, Umar, was that a dhimmi was forbidden to study the Koran. The chief mark of dhimmitude today is ignorance of the Koran, the Sira and the Hadith. The ignorance of kafir intellectuals about Islam is profound.


They don't know about how jihad killed the 120,000,000 Africans, the 60,000,000 Christians, the 80,000,000 Hindus or the 10,000,000 Buddhists. Our intellectuals do not know about the Tears of Jihad (detailed in all of our books). That is a lot of death and ignorance?270,000,000 dead. Our intellectuals don't know, don't care and don't bother. They deny.


University Islamic studies never mention the Islamic political doctrine. The media discusses Islam in terms of political correctness, and multiculturalism. History courses don?t teach about the civilizational annihilation due to jihad. Religious leaders placate imams in public gatherings and have no knowledge what the imam actually thinks of them. Political thinkers do not even know Islam as a political force


The problem with this ignorance is that our intellectuals are unable to help us. They do not understand that Islam is a civilization based upon the ideal of dualism. Islamic ethics and politics have one set of rules for Muslims and another for kafirs. Our civilization is based upon the ideal of unitary ethics, the Golden Rule. We do not have two sets of laws and ethics, like Islam. Our intellectuals cannot explain what dualism has meant in the past or what it will mean for our future?civilizational annihilation.


Our intellectuals and the media have only one view of Islam?a glorious civilization. They have created the "terrorist", a bogus term based upon ignorance. And the "terrorist" is not even a "real" Muslim, but an extremist fundamentalist. All of these terms are based upon a profound ignorance of Islamic political doctrine.


Intellectuals cannot connect the dots of persecution of other intellectuals and artists today, such as Salman Rushdie, Theo van Gogh, the Mohammed cartoon riots, and Daniel Pearl. Their persecution is part of a 1400 year Islamic tradition of keeping all intellectuals and artists in line with the doctrine of political Islam. But for our intellectuals, there is no history, no connection, no pattern, no doctrine of Islam. Their only doctrine is the doctrine of denial. These intellectuals write our textbooks. Then our tax dollars buy the books to feed the ignorance.


What explains the intellectuals? silence and ignorance? The enormous violence of jihad has produced the psychology of the ?molested child? syndrome. Intellectuals fear, apologize for, and placate the Islamic abusers, ignoring the violence of the past. Then they turn around and advise our politicians. The result is an ignorant populace who look to our intellectuals for guidance and find treachery and lies.


FP: Bill Warner, thank you for joining us.


Warner: Thank you for standing against political Islam.

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2007, 11:57:50 PM »
Not written by a friend of Islam odiously.

How much do we trust this source?

Henny

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1075
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2007, 06:56:10 AM »
Not written by a friend of Islam odiously.

How much do we trust this source?

Rule of thumb: Trust nothing written about Islam by Front Page Magazine. Ever.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2007, 10:31:04 AM »
Much of this is likely to be true. Slavery was an integral part of life in Arabia during the time of Muhammad, just as it was during Jesus' lifetime. The main difference is that Jesus was too poor to afford slaves, Muhammad wasn't. Jesus himself did comparatively little to spread Christianity during his lifetime, but Muhammad was a serious evangelist. Paul and Peter were far more responsible for spreading Christianity, and, unlike Muhammad, they were powerless to overthrow the status quo government, ie the Roman Empire. Therefore, Christianity was not originally spread by the sward, as was Islam.

Islam means 'submission'. The common name Abdul does not mean "black slave', but only 'slave', presumably to the will of Allah.
Women were chattel and not seen as worthy of being taken seriously. When Mary and Mary Magdalene told the disciples of what they had seen at the tomb, they were not believed. Women were taken less seriously in Arabic culture than in Jewish culture, because in Judaism, the hereditary line follows the mother, not the father, because Sarah's child, though born after Ishmeal, was Sarah's. In Arabian culture, the oldest child, of whatever mother, takes precedence.

It is hard to understand Islam because so many of the texts are written in what can only be described as gibberish. This is a difficulty shared with much of the Bible, but the gibberish of the Koran is harder to understand. I have yet to find a decent biography of Muhammad. There do not seem to be any that is free of either worshipful praise or damnation. Realism is not a virtue of Arabic texts. LIke a seventh-grader's essays, everything is either wonderful and great or hideous and sucky. THis Front Page article seems to be of the later persuasion. Front Page seems to be a propaganda tool in other articles I have read, and I doubt that this is any exception.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2007, 10:32:43 AM by Xavier_Onassis »
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Stray Pooch

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 860
  • Pray tell me, sir, whose dog are you?
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2007, 11:36:15 AM »
The problem with this analysis is that it is so slanted as to be beyond even fleeting credibility. 

As I read the article, I was struck at the inherent cultural hypocrisy implicit in its assertions.   This is pretty much true across the board about the sarcastic "Religion of Peace" arguments I have heard. 

One of the prime virtues of American slavery, conquest of indigenous cultures, and the forced assimilation of those oppressed is that we were "saving their souls."  This differs in no way from the Islamic view of slavery purported in this article.  I see again the same rationalizations about blacks capturing blacks - or Muslims capturing Muslims - to be sold on the American market.  It's like saying "It's not MY fault I use drugs - it's the damn Columbians!"  Islamic conversion by conquest is a fact of history, but it parallels the same tendency in Western civilization.  Islam is no different in its history and traditions than Western civilization.  Our culture has evolved at a faster pace than the culture of Islam, but Islam will come along. 

There is no question that Islamic fundamentalism is a threat to the world - just as fundamentalist Christianity has been in the past.  But the difference between Christian fundamentalism and Islamic fundamentalism is that the former no longer has absolute power anywhere and the latter is becoming dangerously close to gaining it in several places.  The danger in this sort of slanted analysis of Islam is that it is fairly easy to see through - and therefore marginalize.  That's good, but it tends to discredit a lot of perfectly rational concern about Islamic jihad.  That's bad.   
Oh, for a muse of fire, that would ascend the brightest heaven of invention . . .

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2007, 12:41:05 PM »
It doesn't seem to me as though fundamentalist Islam is gaining power.
In theory, this is what governs Saudi Arabia right now. Is Saudi Arabia trying to conquer the West, or convert it to Islam?
I don't think it is very successful if indeed this is the case.

One element of fundie Islam is that it is essentially quite BACKWARD. It prohibits the lending of money at interest, for example. Without this, capitalism as we know it simply does not flourish. Where Islamic countries have flourished, it is because their economies have grown almost exclusively because of the sale of oil and other resources.

It also is not very favorable toward education. Women are given a prefunctory education, and everyone is required to waste a huge amount of time memorizing the Koran.I imagine that this is a handicap similar to the Japanese having to learn four alphabets, or the atrocious spelling of English.

The more people are educated, the more they realize that fundamentalism is bogus. So fundie Islam contains within itself the seeds of its own destruction. As do all kinds of fundamentalism. The world is far more complicated than any fundie can logically claim it is.

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Richpo64

  • Guest
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2007, 02:41:04 PM »
>>Rule of thumb: Trust nothing written about Islam by Front Page Magazine. Ever.<<

Also a rule of thumb: Never trust a Muslim to be objective about Islam.

As for the source, look him up. I don't believe this sort of thing is even remotely common amoung American Muslims or even the majority of Muslim's. It is true however, of a large minorty. You know, the minority of 100 million who would love to cut your American throat. So sit back and deny it if you like, but the world should know about these things.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2007, 04:55:11 PM »
Whether I sit back or lean forward, there isn't one thing I can do about these supposed dangerous Muslims. I imagine that they would prefer to cut Juniorbush's throat or Condi Rice's throat or Dick Cheney's throat long before they got around to me.

The best thing about them is that I am here, and they are there. I imagine that many Americans would be alive today had this country not armed and subsidized dictatorships, Israeli colonists and oilmen in their part of the world.

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #8 on: November 24, 2007, 10:05:39 PM »
Not written by a friend of Islam odiously.

How much do we trust this source?

Rule of thumb: Trust nothing written about Islam by Front Page Magazine. Ever.


Begging the question?

Is this subject described honestly somewhere we can find it?

fatman

  • Guest
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2007, 10:21:51 PM »
Saint Patrick was captured and enslaved by Irish raiders for six years, before he returned to Ireland and began to convert the Emerald Isle to Christianity.

fatman

  • Guest
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2007, 10:30:17 PM »
Also a rule of thumb: Never trust a Muslim to be objective about Islam.

Does this apply also to Christians?  Does this mean that they can't speak objectively regarding Christianity?  Soooo, if Christians can't speak objectively about Christianity, who can?  Wiccans?  Atheists?  Jews?

Your argument is BS here Rich, while there may be some Moslems who can't be objective about Islam, I'm willing to bet that there are some who can.  Objectivity is a matter of filtering the facts from both (or more) sides of an argument to find truth.  Some people are better at it than others.  That someone belongs to the religion, class, occupation, whatever the subject being debated, doesn't necessarily exclude them from the realm of objective argument regarding that subject.  You will only know when they state their views, and they may themselves believe themself to be objective, even if they aren't.
There are several members of this board that could make the case both for and against objectivity.

Henny

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1075
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2007, 06:53:32 AM »
Not written by a friend of Islam odiously.

How much do we trust this source?

Rule of thumb: Trust nothing written about Islam by Front Page Magazine. Ever.


Begging the question?

Is this subject described honestly somewhere we can find it?

I wish I could answer that Plane. These days I see biases everywhere I look (either for or against). I would say that the best chance is your own, open-minded study.

The_Professor

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1735
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2007, 10:49:12 AM »
Not written by a friend of Islam odiously.

How much do we trust this source?

Rule of thumb: Trust nothing written about Islam by Front Page Magazine. Ever.


Begging the question?

Is this subject described honestly somewhere we can find it?

I wish I could answer that Plane. These days I see biases everywhere I look (either for or against). I would say that the best chance is your own, open-minded study.
well, coulld a panel of sunni and shiite immans discussing this issue provide clarity? or, just more confusion?
***************************
"Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for western civilization as it commits suicide."
                                 -- Jerry Pournelle, Ph.D

Henny

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1075
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2007, 01:14:19 PM »
Not written by a friend of Islam odiously.

How much do we trust this source?

Rule of thumb: Trust nothing written about Islam by Front Page Magazine. Ever.


Begging the question?

Is this subject described honestly somewhere we can find it?

I wish I could answer that Plane. These days I see biases everywhere I look (either for or against). I would say that the best chance is your own, open-minded study.
well, coulld a panel of sunni and shiite immans discussing this issue provide clarity? or, just more confusion?

Professor, I think there are panels like this right now, especially in Iraq. Unfortunately, their efforts seem to be fragmented.

Richpo64

  • Guest
Re: Islam, Slavery and Rape
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2007, 06:36:30 PM »
>>Whether I sit back or lean forward, there isn't one thing I can do about these supposed dangerous Muslims.<<

You could if you wanted to, but based on your resistance to anything being done to protect us from these people you could stand on your head and it wouldn't make any difference.

>>I imagine that they would prefer to cut Juniorbush's throat or Condi Rice's throat or Dick Cheney's throat long before they got around to me.<<

I'm sure there were thousands of people who may of thought the same way on 9-11 in New York and Washington, or Madrid in 2004, or London 2005. I'm sorry, but I have to ask if you are really this stupid or has BDS destroyed your brain cells?