Author Topic: In praise of CO2  (Read 2530 times)

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Amianthus

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In praise of CO2
« on: June 10, 2008, 10:36:32 AM »
I've highlighted a relevant passages.

With less heat and less carbon dioxide, the planet could become less hospitable and less green

Lawrence Solomon,  Financial Post  Published: Saturday, June 07, 2008

Planet Earth is on a roll! GPP is way up. NPP is way up. To the surprise of those who have been bearish on the planet, the data shows global production has been steadily climbing to record levels, ones not seen since these measurements began.

GPP is Gross Primary Production, a measure of the daily output of the global biosphere -- the amount of new plant matter on land. NPP is Net Primary Production, an annual tally of the globe's production. Biomass is booming. The planet is the greenest it's been in decades, perhaps in centuries.

Until the 1980s, ecologists had no way to systematically track growth in plant matter in every corner of the Earth -- the best they could do was analyze small plots of one-tenth of a hectare or less. The notion of continuously tracking global production to discover the true state of the globe's biota was not even considered.

Then, in the 1980s, ecologists realized that satellites could track production, and enlisted NASA to collect the data. For the first time, ecologists did not need to rely on rough estimates or anecdotal evidence of the health of the ecology: They could objectively measure the land's output and soon did -- on a daily basis and down to the last kilometre.

The results surprised Steven Running of the University of Montana and Ramakrishna Nemani of NASA, scientists involved in analyzing the NASA data. They found that over a period of almost two decades, the Earth as a whole became more bountiful by a whopping 6.2%. About 25% of the Earth's vegetated landmass -- almost 110 million square kilometres -- enjoyed significant increases and only 7% showed significant declines. When the satellite data zooms in, it finds that each square metre of land, on average, now produces almost 500 grams of greenery per year.

Why the increase? Their 2004 study, and other more recent ones, point to the warming of the planet and the presence of CO2, a gas indispensable to plant life. CO2 is nature's fertilizer, bathing the biota with its life-giving nutrients. Plants take the carbon from CO2 to bulk themselves up -- carbon is the building block of life -- and release the oxygen, which along with the plants, then sustain animal life. As summarized in a report last month, released along with a petition signed by 32,000 U. S. scientists who vouched for the benefits of CO2: "Higher CO2 enables plants to grow faster and larger and to live in drier climates. Plants provide food for animals, which are thereby also enhanced. The extent and diversity of plant and animal life have both increased substantially during the past half-century."

Lush as the planet may now be, it is as nothing compared to earlier times, when levels of CO2 and Earth temperatures were far higher. In the age of the dinosaur, for example, CO2 levels may have been five to 10 times higher than today, spurring a luxuriantly fertile planet whose plant life sated the immense animals of that era. Planet Earth is also much cooler today than during the hothouse era of the dinosaur, and cooler than it was 1,000 years ago during the Medieval Warming Period, when the Vikings colonized a verdant Greenland. Greenland lost its colonies and its farmland during the Little Ice Age that followed, and only recently started to become green again.

This blossoming Earth could now be in jeopardy, for reasons both natural and man-made. According to a growing number of scientists, the period of global warming that we have experienced over the past few centuries as Earth climbed out of the Little Ice Age is about to end. The oceans, which have been releasing their vast store of carbon dioxide as the planet has warmed -- CO2 is released from oceans as they warm and dissolves in them when they cool -- will start to take the carbon dioxide back. With less heat and less carbon dioxide, the planet could become less hospitable and less green, especially in areas such as Canada's Boreal forests, which have been major beneficiaries of the increase in GPP and NPP.

Doubling the jeopardy for Earth is man. Unlike the many scientists who welcome CO2 for its benefits, many other scientists and most governments believe carbon dioxide to be a dangerous pollutant that must be removed from the atmosphere at all costs. Governments around the world are now enacting massive programs in an effort to remove as much as 80% of the carbon dioxide emissions from the atmosphere.

If these governments are right, they will have done us all a service. If they are wrong, the service could be all ill, with food production dropping world wide, and the countless ecological niches on which living creatures depend stressed. The second order effects could be dire, too. To bolster food production, humans will likely turn to energy intensive manufactured fertilizers, depleting our store of non-renewable resources. Techniques to remove carbon from the atmosphere also sound alarms. Carbon sequestration, a darling of many who would mitigate climate change, could become a top inducer of earthquakes, according to Christian Klose, a geohazards researcher at Columbia University's Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory. Because the carbon sequestration schemes tend to be located near cities, he notes, carbon-sequestration-caused earthquakes could exact an unusually high toll.

Amazingly, although the risks of action are arguably at least as real as the risks of inaction, Canada and other countries are rushing into Earth-altering carbon schemes with nary a doubt. Environmentalists, who ordinarily would demand a full-fledged environmental assessment before a highway or a power plant can be built, are silent on the need to question proponents or examine alternatives.

Earth is on a roll. Governments are too. We will know soon enough if we're rolled off a cliff.

Original Article
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Brassmask

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2008, 04:32:40 PM »
Bragging about the increase in CO2 as we speedily decrease the amount of trees on the planet is kind of the most god damned stupidest thing I've ever heard of in my entire fucking life.  Just like every other god damned thing you guys brag about.

Amianthus

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2008, 05:48:26 PM »
Bragging about the increase in CO2 as we speedily decrease the amount of trees on the planet is kind of the most god damned stupidest thing I've ever heard of in my entire fucking life.

I guess you didn't read the article.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Brassmask

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2008, 08:40:29 PM »
No I read the horsecrap article.  But there seems to be no mentioning of the daily destruction of thousands of square miles of rainforest.

In fact, it blatantly ignores that fact.

If there has been added vegetation, it is in places that glaciers used to exist. 

Maybe we should start getting all excited about the increase in WATER on the earth!  Hey, you know what?!?!?  All the floods and earthquakes and forest fires and tornadoes and tsunamis and typhoons are SOOOOO good for the economy!  Think of all the people who are going to make a few more dollars selling wood to people who have to rebuild!

Yippee!


Plane

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2008, 09:46:16 PM »
Just a little warming might be very good news for Siberia and Canada.

Amianthus

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2008, 10:40:54 PM »
No I read the horsecrap article.  But there seems to be no mentioning of the daily destruction of thousands of square miles of rainforest.

In fact, it blatantly ignores that fact.

Then you missed the highlighted part that read "the Earth as a whole became more bountiful by a whopping 6.2%". That means that in some sections it was reduced, in others it grew more, but AS A WHOLE it was an increase.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Brassmask

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2008, 02:42:04 PM »
No I read the horsecrap article.  But there seems to be no mentioning of the daily destruction of thousands of square miles of rainforest.

In fact, it blatantly ignores that fact.

Then you missed the highlighted part that read "the Earth as a whole became more bountiful by a whopping 6.2%". That means that in some sections it was reduced, in others it grew more, but AS A WHOLE it was an increase.

But that's the point, don't you get it?

We don't want some parts of the world to be "bountiful".  We NEED some parts of the world be BARREN and covered with ICE.

Amianthus

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2008, 03:13:55 PM »
We don't want some parts of the world to be "bountiful".  We NEED some parts of the world be BARREN and covered with ICE.

Why? With increasing population, we need more food production, ie, the world needs to be more bountiful.

As the article says, there were periods in Earth's history when there was 5-10 times as much CO2 in the atmosphere and temperatures averaged much higher than today. The world has recently (last 500-700 years) been in a mini cooling period, now it's warming back up.

Modern humans evolved during the last big warming period, and that last big cool period (10,000 or so years ago) killed off our main competition. Another warming period is likely to be good for the human race.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Brassmask

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2008, 05:21:26 PM »
We don't want some parts of the world to be "bountiful".  We NEED some parts of the world be BARREN and covered with ICE.

Why? With increasing population, we need more food production, ie, the world needs to be more bountiful.

As the article says, there were periods in Earth's history when there was 5-10 times as much CO2 in the atmosphere and temperatures averaged much higher than today. The world has recently (last 500-700 years) been in a mini cooling period, now it's warming back up.

Modern humans evolved during the last big warming period, and that last big cool period (10,000 or so years ago) killed off our main competition. Another warming period is likely to be good for the human race.

I don't think that the warming period that we created is going to be "good" for us.  This article sounds like some right-wing propanda (I think UPrince refers to this sort of thing as "AMBE".)

Amianthus

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2008, 05:25:18 PM »
I don't think that the warming period that we created is going to be "good" for us.

Yeah, we're so good we created a warming period on Mars as well.

At most, humans have contributed a small amount to the current warming period. As I have pointed out numerous times, there have been many warming periods combined with spikes of CO2, most of them well before human beings existed or had industry.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2008, 05:28:30 PM »
I would imagine that a warmer Earth would be good for some (farmers in Alberta) and worse for others (people living at 1 ft. above sea level in Bangladesh).
 
It would flood many coastal communities, and  what was productive farmland could become a desert.

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Brassmask

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2008, 05:29:31 PM »
I don't think that the warming period that we created is going to be "good" for us.

Yeah, we're so good we created a warming period on Mars as well.

At most, humans have contributed a small amount to the current warming period. As I have pointed out numerous times, there have been many warming periods combined with spikes of CO2, most of them well before human beings existed or had industry.

You have no clue if Mars is going through a warming period.  No one does.

Regardless of previous warming trends, man has created THIS one and if the earth is going through a natural warming cycle, it will much worse due to our having spent the last 100 or so years pumping CO2 into the atmosphere.


Amianthus

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #12 on: June 11, 2008, 05:54:08 PM »
You have no clue if Mars is going through a warming period.  No one does.

Sure we do. NASA has been collecting data on it for a while now.

Regardless of previous warming trends, man has created THIS one and if the earth is going through a natural warming cycle, it will much worse due to our having spent the last 100 or so years pumping CO2 into the atmosphere.

No, man has contributed a very slight increase to the current warming trend. High side estimates are 5%. More likely, the contribution is in the area of 2-3%.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Universe Prince

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #13 on: June 11, 2008, 06:10:59 PM »
I don't think that the warming period that we created is going to be "good" for us.  This article sounds like some right-wing propanda (I think UPrince refers to this sort of thing as "AMBE".)

Actually, I think the article is correct. And a warmer Earth may very well be a good thing in the long run. At this point, I've accepted that the planet is getting warmer. What I have not accepted is that anything mankind contributed to it makes a significant difference, or that trying to stop it will in any way be good or even actually possible. These things I don't accept because I haven't seen any actual solid evidence to support these things.
Your reality, sir, is lies and balderdash and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever.
--Hieronymus Karl Frederick Baron von Munchausen ("The Adventures of Baron Munchausen" [1988])--

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: In praise of CO2
« Reply #14 on: June 11, 2008, 07:05:58 PM »
In the last issue of Newsweek, there is an article about a fellow who is researching the development of an organism (some sort of bacteria) that will eat CO2 and produce a satisfactory gasoline substitute.

I hope he is successful and not too greedy/
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."