A Sign of Weakness

[Kramer]

<<so mike would you agree that somebody exceptional enough to be president of the USA should be able to quit smoking cold turkey, after all it's not uncommon for people to quit without drugs or other props?>>

Sure he  SHOULD be able to quit cold turkey.  I'm not sure why he doesn't. 

mike asks: "I'm not sure why he doesn't."?

because he's selfish & weak that's why

he should quit smoking for his own children and his entire family but also it sets a bad example for America's youth.

[Kramer]

I don't think that 'cold turkey' will be the BEST way to quit for everyone, but it might be the best way for most. There are a variety of Rx drugs that can work pretty well, I understand.

Using a pill called "Bantron" I managed to quit for almost a year once. Then I stared dating a chain smoker. Bad move. Buy the time I finally quit, Bantron had been taken off the market.
It made cigarettes taste perfectly awful, as I recall.

did you and him smoke after sex or did you break up due to health concerns?

[Xavier_Onassis]

Roosevelt smoked, and we have seen pictures or Olebush puffing away on a stogie. Obama takes care not to be photographed smoking. I'd say that it's his own business whether he smokes or not. Anyone who has ever smoked knows what a difficult thing it is to quit, especially when one is under a lot of stress. It's not healthy to be president, either. Look at how the job has aged everyone who has served as president.

Bitching about selfishness and weakness is simply petty and low. Pretty much what we can always expect from Kramer.

[Kramer]

Roosevelt smoked, and we have seen pictures or Olebush puffing away on a stogie. Obama takes care not to be photographed smoking. I'd say that it's his own business whether he smokes or not. Anyone who has ever smoked knows what a difficult thing it is to quit, especially when one is under a lot of stress. It's not healthy to be president, either. Look at how the job has aged everyone who has served as president.

Bitching about selfishness and weakness is simply petty and low. Pretty much what we can always expect from Kramer.

how would you describe Obama's admitted cocaine and pot use? with regards to setting an example for our youth?

[Plane]

I want him to quit when he retires.

Right now he is bad enough without adding additional crankyness.

[Michael Tee]

<<how would you describe Obama's admitted cocaine and pot use? with regards to setting an example for our youth? >>

I think America's got a huge problem with selective drug intolerance.  It's asinine and hypocritical.  I don't think any less of a person for downing a shot of Jack Daniels and I don't think any less of him for smoking pot or doing a few lines of coke.

If you're looking for a total abstainer, you are looking for a total nerd.  Fuck dat.  (Unless the guy abstained for religious principles, as do my Mormon friends and neighbours)

[Kramer]

<<how would you describe Obama's admitted cocaine and pot use? with regards to setting an example for our youth? >>

I think America's got a huge problem with selective drug intolerance.  It's asinine and hypocritical.  I don't think any less of a person for downing a shot of Jack Daniels and I don't think any less of him for smoking pot or doing a few lines of coke.

If you're looking for a total abstainer, you are looking for a total nerd.  Fuck dat.  (Unless the guy abstained for religious principles, as do my Mormon friends and neighbours)

you avoided answering the question about setting an example to youth.

[Michael Tee]

<<you avoided answering the question about setting an example to youth.>>

It's not an easy question to answer.

Doing coke as a youth, he wasn't a public figure and he wasn't able to serve as an example to anyone.  If anything, I think his youthful use of coke would set an example to some people with similar pasts that youthful cocaine use is not a bar to seeking the highest office in the land.  They would be enabled and empowered to be the best they can be, rather than giving up on themselves, thanks to Obama's example. 

OTOH, you apparently fear that some young people would be enticed into cocaine use by the example of Obama.  I find that highly dubious - - personally I never met anyone who used coke because they thought that some politician did.    People use coke (IMHO) to have fun, not to emulate some politician.  I think rock stars and film stars can be more effective "salesmen" for coke than politicians, but even there, in the end, it's always a personal decision of an individual, to snort or not to snort. 

In any event, Mr. Independence & Self-Reliance, what about individual responsibility for one's actions?  Assuming that using coke on balance has a negative overall effect on the nation rather than a positive (which I'm certainly not prepared to concede) people are free to decide for themselves and must bear themselves the responsibility for their decisions. 

Would you be as condemnatory if the substance were alcohol rather than dope?  This "setting an example for the youth" doesn't go very far, IMHO, if it starts to impinge on the way I, or Obama, or anyone else, wants to live his life.

[Kramer]

<<you avoided answering the question about setting an example to youth.>>

It's not an easy question to answer.

Doing coke as a youth, he wasn't a public figure and he wasn't able to serve as an example to anyone.  If anything, I think his youthful use of coke would set an example to some people with similar pasts that youthful cocaine use is not a bar to seeking the highest office in the land.  They would be enabled and empowered to be the best they can be, rather than giving up on themselves, thanks to Obama's example. 

OTOH, you apparently fear that some young people would be enticed into cocaine use by the example of Obama.  I find that highly dubious - - personally I never met anyone who used coke because they thought that some politician did.    People use coke (IMHO) to have fun, not to emulate some politician.  I think rock stars and film stars can be more effective "salesmen" for coke than politicians, but even there, in the end, it's always a personal decision of an individual, to snort or not to snort. 

In any event, Mr. Independence & Self-Reliance, what about individual responsibility for one's actions?  Assuming that using coke on balance has a negative overall effect on the nation rather than a positive (which I'm certainly not prepared to concede) people are free to decide for themselves and must bear themselves the responsibility for their decisions. 

Would you be as condemnatory if the substance were alcohol rather than dope?  This "setting an example for the youth" doesn't go very far, IMHO, if it starts to impinge on the way I, or Obama, or anyone else, wants to live his life.

it's a very easy answer. Obama is a weak person with low self worth & low self image and poor character. falling under the spell of cocaine, smokes, pot and booze is not what good people do, that's what losers do. It is a terrible example to our youth. Had he done what GW Bush did and denounce them and come clean he would show a character. Him being half black and an POOR example to black children isn't doing our country any favors.

[Michael Tee]

You're way too judgmental, IMHO.  A lot of people use booze and/or dope and happen to be extremely successful in their chosen fields.  You rely too much on myth and stereotype.  Some can handle booze or dope, some can't.  End of story.

[Kramer]

You're way too judgmental, IMHO.  A lot of people use booze and/or dope and happen to be extremely successful in their chosen fields.  You rely too much on myth and stereotype.  Some can handle booze or dope, some can't.  End of story.

we only have one president and whoever that person is they should be the best of the best and the cream of the crop. We don't need some community organizing smoker gangsta from the hood with zero experience as our president.

[Michael Tee]

<<we only have one president and whoever that person is they should be the best of the best and the cream of the crop.>>

Well, that woulda bin Dennis Kucinich.  But the cards are stacked against guys like that.

<<We don't need some community organizing smoker gangsta from the hood with zero experience as our president.>>

You seem to be exaggerating slightly there, Kramer.  But I do get the feeling that you don't like this guy.  Neither do I, not any more.

[Kramer]

<<we only have one president and whoever that person is they should be the best of the best and the cream of the crop.>>

Well, that woulda bin Dennis Kucinich.  But the cards are stacked against guys like that.

<<We don't need some community organizing smoker gangsta from the hood with zero experience as our president.>>

You seem to be exaggerating slightly there, Kramer.  But I do get the feeling that you don't like this guy.  Neither do I, not any more.

Mike if you don't like him then progress is being made. I wonder if your counterparts in the US, the ones that voted for obama, feel betrayed, lied to, used and deceived?

[Michael Tee]

<<Mike if you don't like him then progress is being made. >>

The guy leads people on and deceives them, and that's progress?  That I know when I've been fucked in the ass is progress?  It's the poorest kind of progress I can ever imagine.

<<I wonder if your counterparts in the US, the ones that voted for obama, feel betrayed, lied to, used and deceived?>>

I know for a fact some of them do.  Just read the commentaries in Antiwar.com, truthout.org or even some in hufpo.  But it's a mixed bag, the general consensus seems to be he's still way better than McCain-Palin woulda bin, and I think for some voters the concept of a black man in the Oval Office outweighs all other considerations.  He seems to have acted well and decisively in the auto industry rescue.  I dunno, I can not say the guy is ALL bad, but I am disappointed enough in some of his decisions on torture that I might consider staying home on Election Day if I were an American and he were running again.  OTOH, depending on the awfulness of the GOP slate, I probably wouldn't.

[Kramer]

<<Mike if you don't like him then progress is being made. >>

The guy leads people on and deceives them, and that's progress?  That I know when I've been fucked in the ass is progress?  It's the poorest kind of progress I can ever imagine.

<<I wonder if your counterparts in the US, the ones that voted for obama, feel betrayed, lied to, used and deceived?>>

I know for a fact some of them do.  Just read the commentaries in Antiwar.com, truthout.org or even some in hufpo.  But it's a mixed bag, the general consensus seems to be he's still way better than McCain-Palin woulda bin, and I think for some voters the concept of a black man in the Oval Office outweighs all other considerations.  He seems to have acted well and decisively in the auto industry rescue.  I dunno, I can not say the guy is ALL bad, but I am disappointed enough in some of his decisions on torture that I might consider staying home on Election Day if I were an American and he were running again.  OTOH, depending on the awfulness of the GOP slate, I probably wouldn't.

Obama recently learned what I learned years ago -- you can't please all the people all of the time. Does that make our president as smart as he was made out to be prior to 2009 or kinda naive?