Author Topic: The Commies Finally Get It!  (Read 18802 times)

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Michael Tee

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #45 on: June 22, 2010, 01:34:30 AM »
<<And yet there you go defending Communism as if it was not [slavery].>>

It is the height of absurdity, realized only in lunatic Cold War propaganda, to equate communism with slavery.   The total abolition of all private property (Communism)  is at the complete opposite end of the spectrum from chattel slavery in which all means of production including the workers is private property.

Amianthus

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #46 on: June 22, 2010, 01:49:05 AM »
"Do what the party requires or go up against the wall" is not any type of freedom I'm interested in...
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Michael Tee

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #47 on: June 22, 2010, 01:55:35 AM »
<<"Do what the party requires or go up against the wall" is not any type of freedom I'm interested in...>>

"Up against the wall" is reserved only for real enemies of the people, i.e., enemies of the Revolution.  There are less potent sanctions available for less dangerous people.  It's true that there is not the same degree of intellectual freedom under communism as there is under capitalism.  However, plane was attempting to make the absurd claim that the lack of freedom of citizens of a communist country was equivalent to the lack of freedom of chattel slaves.  That is totally ridiculous.  Anyone who has lived under communism, if he is honest, would laugh himself silly at the comparison with chattel slavery.

Plane

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #48 on: June 22, 2010, 02:13:28 AM »
<<"Do what the party requires or go up against the wall" is not any type of freedom I'm interested in...>>

"Up against the wall" is reserved only for real enemies of the people, i.e., enemies of the Revolution.  There are less potent sanctions available for less dangerous people.  It's true that there is not the same degree of intellectual freedom under communism as there is under capitalism.  However, plane was attempting to make the absurd claim that the lack of freedom of citizens of a communist country was equivalent to the lack of freedom of chattel slaves.  That is totally ridiculous.  Anyone who has lived under communism, if he is honest, would laugh himself silly at the comparison with chattel slavery.


I think that Communism would kill me .

Because I like to be free.



I do not mind compareing the ownership of my person in chattel by another.

To the ownership of all that I must have to live by the govenor.

Six of one
Square root of thirty six of the other.



Michael Tee

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #49 on: June 22, 2010, 06:52:14 AM »
<<I think that Communism would kill me .

<<Because I like to be free.>>

That's hilarious for a guy who grew up in the segregated South.  Were you free to date anyone you liked regardless of skin colour?  Were you free to tell the world what you thought of the KKK?   Were you killed because you like to be free?



<<I do not mind compareing the ownership of my person in chattel by another.

<<To the ownership of all that I must have to live by the govenor.

<<Six of one
<<Square root of thirty six of the other.>>

The square root of your absurdity is that you equate ownership of property with ownership of a human being.  In other words, human life and human dignity are worth no more than ownership of any chattel. 

Which, of course, is pathetic.

kimba1

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #50 on: June 22, 2010, 10:32:50 AM »
uhm actually the south today is quite different then the days of old. true the n-words is said openly in many areas. but overall people there are very open to all races. as long as you understand not to let certain verbal ques upset you the south can be a very nice . it`s alot like being in paris and deal with being called a stupid. when you let it pass it becomers a pleasent stay.

but that method applies with most places of travel.

Plane

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #51 on: June 22, 2010, 09:22:07 PM »
<<I think that Communism would kill me .

<<Because I like to be free.>>

That's hilarious for a guy who grew up in the segregated South.  Were you free to date anyone you liked regardless of skin colour?  Were you free to tell the world what you thought of the KKK?   Were you killed because you like to be free?



<<I do not mind compareing the ownership of my person in chattel by another.

<<To the ownership of all that I must have to live by the govenor.

<<Six of one
<<Square root of thirty six of the other.>>

The square root of your absurdity is that you equate ownership of property with ownership of a human being.  In other words, human life and human dignity are worth no more than ownership of any chattel. 

Which, of course, is pathetic.


Everyone can be improved  , but I am used to the freedom of being an American.

I remember , (because I am old) members of the KKK braging of it in public. That would be rare now , interracial couples have gone the other way, from scarce to common.

Lets say that I owned you as a slave , I would put you in the best most healthy circumstance I could , but you would reseent the unfairness of the whole arrangement and escape me at your first oppurtunity .

But replace "me" with a beneficient Communist government , and you would be as happy as a clam while I set you up in the best way I can .

Slave owners were obliged to look after their slaves and some of them were successfull in this respect  , and in just this respect some Communist governmments are equilly successfull.

kimba1

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #52 on: June 23, 2010, 12:00:46 AM »
look at in terms of making a living.

a job or having your own business

both have advantages and disadvantages , also have certain sacrifices

to exactly different to the subject at hand

Plane

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #53 on: June 23, 2010, 12:07:12 AM »
<<And yet there you go defending Communism as if it was not [slavery].>>

It is the height of absurdity, realized only in lunatic Cold War propaganda, to equate communism with slavery.   The total abolition of all private property (Communism)  is at the complete opposite end of the spectrum from chattel slavery in which all means of production including the workers is private property.

Either way it is the individual that winds up as a dependant who owns so little that his dependancy is enforced.

The opposite end of this spectrum is self relyance and freedom.

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #54 on: June 23, 2010, 12:26:45 AM »
"Up against the wall" is reserved only for real enemies of the people...

Musta been lots of people that were enemies of the people  ::)
 
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Michael Tee

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #55 on: June 23, 2010, 12:23:02 PM »
<<Lets say that I owned you as a slave , I would put you in the best most healthy circumstance I could . . . >>

That is simply not true.  In fact, it's quite absurd.  My best and most healthy circumstance would require regular medical attention, at times expensive medication, bed rest when required, regular and stress-free time off, ergonometric tools and dry, insulated cabins with plenty of fresh air and sunshine, kept cool in summer and warm in winter, plus a healthy and nutritious diet.

Assuming that you are sane and reasonable, your concern with me would begin and end at the concept of cost-benefit analysis.  At the minimum possible outlay on your part, you need to get a good day's work out of me each and every day.  When the cost of meeting my health and other needs approaches the cost of my replacement with another slave in better condition, that is the day I am thrown on the scrap heap.  Since I was not paid any wages for my years of labour for you, I have no resources of my own to fall back on.  I am now left to sink or swim by a master who doesn't really give a shit if I live or die, any more than he cares what happens to his old sofa or chest of drawers.

Moreover, even as a healthy and productive worker, if I don't feel like taking any more of your shit one day and mouth off at you, or if I should show any visible attraction to one of your womenfolk (or she to me) you can have me flogged or horsewhipped, probably even to death.

kimba1

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #56 on: June 23, 2010, 01:38:47 PM »
actually that`s just a percieved notion of slavery . I`m not sure it`s possible to dispose of elderly slaves without dealing with slave revolts. you can`t be treating slaves like the irish without some kind of backlash.

Michael Tee

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #57 on: June 23, 2010, 06:26:43 PM »
Well, kimba, when you find out where they had their rest homes for old slaves, let me know.  My guess is that you wouldn't need too many of them because the longevity of the slaves was probably a hell of a lot shorter than that of their masters.  Most of them paid the price for working too long under harsh, unsafe and unhealthy conditions, with poor food and medical care.  There was probably an optimum ratio of dollars paid for the slave versus average working lifetime left.  The American worker or farmer had no social security, why the hell would a slave?

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #58 on: June 23, 2010, 06:36:00 PM »
The American worker or farmer had no social security,

you gotta be kidding?...well golly jee....how did they make it without the largest government
program in the world and the single greatest expenditure in the federal budget?
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Michael Tee

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Re: The Commies Finally Get It!
« Reply #59 on: June 23, 2010, 06:55:29 PM »
<<....how did they make it without the largest government
program in the world and the single greatest expenditure in the federal budget?>>

First of all it is not the largest or the greatest anything, because many countries - - most of Western Europe, for example - - take much better care of their sick, injured and retired workers than the U.S. has ever done.  But in answer to your question, how did they ever make it, the answer in many cases is, that they did not make it.  They succumbed to illness, poverty, desperation and tried to flesh out family income by putting children out to work in the mines and factories, took unsafe and unhealthy jobs for the few extra pennies they brought, etc.  The American worker was much worse off before the New Deal than after.