Author Topic: This is not good........  (Read 7784 times)

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Christians4LessGvt

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This is not good........
« on: December 08, 2011, 11:23:03 PM »
Iran exhibits US drone undamaged.
US and Israeli intelligence shocked


DEBKAfile Special Report

December 8, 2011


Iran displays captured US RQ-170 drone

Iran exhibited the top-secret US stealth drone RQ-170 Sentinel captured on Sunday, Dec. 4. Its almost perfect condition confirmed Tehran's claim that the UAV was downed by a cyber attack, meaning it was not shot down but brought in undamaged by an electronic warfare ambush.

This is a major debacle for the stealth technology the US uses in its warplanes and the drone technology developed by the US and Israel.

The state of the lost UAV refutes the US military contention that the Sentinel's systems malfunctioned. If this had happened, it would have crashed and either been wrecked or damaged. The condition of the RQ-170 intact obliges the US and Israel to make major changes in plans for a potential strike against Iran's nuclear program.

Earlier Thursday, debkafile reported:

The Obama administration's decision after internal debate not to send US commando or air units into Iran to retrieve or destroy the secret RQ-170 stealth drone which fell into Iranian hands has strengthened the hands of the Israeli faction which argues the case for striking Iran's nuclear installations without waiting for the Americans to make their move.

Senior Israeli diplomatic and security officials who followed the discussion in Washington concluded that, by failing to act, the administration has left Iran not only with the secrets of the Sentinel's stealth coating, its sensors and cameras, but also with the data stored in its computer cells on targets marked out by the US and/or Israeli for attack.

debkafile?s military sources say that this knowledge compels the US and Israel to revise their plans of attack for aborting the Iranian nuclear program.

Like every clandestine weapons system, the RQ-170 had a self-destruct mechanism to prevent its secrets spilling out to the enemy in the event of a crash or capture. This did not happen. Tehran was able to claim the spy drone was only slightly damaged when they downed it.

The NATO spokesman claimed control was lost of the US UAV and it went missing, a common occurrence for these unmanned aircraft.

The enigmas surrounding its capture continue to pile up. How did Iran know the drone had entered its airspace? How was it caused to land? Most of all, why did the craft's self-destruct mechanism which is programmed to activate automatically fail to work? And if it malfunctioned, why was it not activated by remote control?

Thursday, Dec. 8, The New York Times and the Wall Street Journal reported that from Sunday, Dec. 4, when Tehran announced the stealth drone's capture, the Obama administration weighed sending special commando forces into Iran from bases in Afghanistan to bring the downed aircraft back to Afghanistan or blow it up to destroy the almost intact secret systems - either by a sneak operation or by an air strike.

Iranian officials said the drone was detected near the Iranian town of Kashmar, 200 kilometers from the Afghan border and presumably moved to a military or air base inside the country. The NYT disclosed that the special force would have used "allied agents inside Iran" to hunt down the missing aircraft, the first time Washington has admitted to support from "allied agents" operating covertly in Iran.

In the end, the paper quoted a US official as explaining that the attack option was ruled out "because of the potential it could become a larger incident." If an assault team entered the country, the US "could be accused of an act of war" by Tehran.
The Obama administration's internal discussion on how to handle the loss of the high-value reconnaissance drone was followed tensely in Jerusalem. The decision it took against mounting a mission to recover or destroy the top-secret Sentinel was perceived in Israel as symptomatic of a wider decision to call off the covert war America has been conducting for some months against Iran's drive for a nuclear bomb ? at least until the damage caused by RQ-170 incident is fully assessed.
A senior Israeli security official had this to say: ?Everything that?s happened around the RQ-170 shows that when it comes to Iran and its nuclear program, the Obama administration and Israel have different objectives. On this issue, each country needs to go its own way.?
 
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Plane

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2011, 01:19:57 AM »
Dang.



There may be a reason to keep manned aircraft around after all.

kimba1

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2011, 02:26:21 AM »
How was it caused to land? Most of all, why did the craft's self-destruct mechanism which is programmed to activate automatically fail to work? And if it malfunctioned, why was it not activated by remote control?

A friend of mine whose still in afghanistan talked about military tech and said it's the very best technology politics will pay for.

The expression " no excuses " is wishful thinking in the military.

BT

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2011, 02:52:18 AM »
Wasn't there a story about a virus attacking air force computers where the drones were guided from in Nevada a couple months ago. The DoD denied that the guidance computers were affected.

Guess not.


BT

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Xavier_Onassis

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2011, 09:21:11 AM »
They have satellites and very high-flying aircraft that can accomplish any surveillance that a drone can do. So this thing should never have been over Iran in the first place.


A senior Israeli security official had this to say: ?Everything that?s happened around the RQ-170 shows that when it comes to Iran and its nuclear program, the Obama administration and Israel have different objectives. On this issue, each country needs to go its own way.
 
Yeah, and the Israelis can PAY for their own weapons and stuff as well.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

BSB

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2011, 10:50:14 AM »
First of all, no one has any idea what really happened here, least of all the Dukakaphiles. Second, of course the U.S. and Israel are going their own way on Iran. There is nothing special about the U.S/Israeli relationship even though there are people who want you to think there is. Third, these kinds events have been taking place for decades. One side gets an upper hand technology wise, than bingo, the other side catches up, things get redone, than it all happens again. And during all this one side is faking one thing, doing another, telling the public this, doing that, making a big deal out of A, so you won't pay any attention to B, and on and on.

Many decades ago the U.S. sent a unit into North Vietnam to get some of our POWs out. They "failed". A big deal was made out of the attempt, both positive and negative. The press was all over it. One problem though. The POW compound wasn't the real target. Another team had inserted north of the POW camp, stole a bran new Russian Radar set up, and brought it back here. The public was never told about that though. 

BSB

Amianthus

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2011, 12:44:52 PM »
They have satellites and very high-flying aircraft that can accomplish any surveillance that a drone can do. So this thing should never have been over Iran in the first place.

Drones can get views that are not available from higher surveillance sources (notably, looking *under* things from near ground level).

Also, drones can deploy close in weapons that are not available from the other sources.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #8 on: December 09, 2011, 01:11:42 PM »
The US claimed it lost a drone. The Iranians claim to have captured a drone. Wouldn't it be possible for the Iranians to
build a fiberglass mockup, just to bother the Americans? The bottom of the drone in the picture is covered, so there is no guarantee that this is the real thing.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

BSB

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2011, 01:44:46 PM »
Or the bottom half is covered because it's damaged, meaning they didn't cyber attack it out of the sky and bring it down for a nice soft landing. I heard that if you get a good look at the picture from Iran you can see a crack in one of the wings.

Time may tell, or it might not, or the truth maybe the obvious. That being, they do have a very sensitive piece of US equipment, and it isn't good for us at the moment.

Apparently this drone, an RQ-170, can, according to a NYTs article I read, "..linger undetected for hours at 50,000 feet.."

BSB


kimba1

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2011, 02:58:41 PM »
I wonder how much tech can they reverse engineer? Is iran advanced enough to make thier own drones and what kinds of confidential data would be useful to iran?

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2011, 03:10:11 PM »
There is nothing special about the U.S/Israeli relationship even
though there are people who want you to think there is.

Yeah nutty "people" like...

President Obama
"Obviously, no ally is more important than the state of Israel"
Nov 30, 2011


President Clinton
"American and Israel share a special bond. Our relationship is unique among all nations. Like America, Israel is a strong democracy, a symbol of freedom, and an oasis of liberty, a home to the oppressed and persecuted"


Secretary of State Hillary Clinton
"We have a close, unshakable bond between the United States and Israel, and between the American and Israeli people"
« Last Edit: December 09, 2011, 10:06:28 PM by Christians4LessGvt »
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

Christians4LessGvt

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2011, 03:11:41 PM »
I wonder how much tech can they reverse engineer? Is iran advanced enough to make thier own drones and what kinds of confidential data would be useful to iran?

Kimba...this was most likely a Russian...maybe Chinese joint operation with Iran.
They really could not have dont it on their own.
So yes Russia and/or China can "reverse engineer".
"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!" - Ronald Reagan - June 12, 1987

BSB

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #13 on: December 09, 2011, 04:05:47 PM »
The nutty people are those who don't know the difference between what is said for diplomatic reasons, and what is true. Israel would cut our throat in a NY second, and we would return the favor. 


BSB

kimba1

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Re: This is not good........
« Reply #14 on: December 09, 2011, 04:10:55 PM »
Upon thinking about it, even if thiers is no ties before. Iran can trade that drone to china for anything they want and china will be more than happy to do it.