Ladies & Gentlemen...Meet The Next President of the United States!

[Xavier_Onassis]

Nonetheless, Reagan was a dolt, and Romney will lose.

[BSB]

XO: "How long would the "perfect" Reagan have kept Marines in Lebanon?"

CU4: "For as long as needed. See Germany. See South Korea."

So the situation in Lebanon in the 1980s was comparable to the situation in Germany post WWII, and the situation in South Korea post the Korean War? And the U.S's position in Lebanon was comparable to our position in post war Germany, and post war South Korea?

You see stuff like this and it's so far afield that there's no point in trying to communicate with the source. MT used to post stuff like this. There's so much unpacking to do before you can even start all you can do is say, fuck it. 

BSB


P.S. Happy Holidays

[Christians4LessGvt]

Romney/Christie?

dont be surprised RR!

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/12/30/christie_after_three_years_of_obama_we_are_hopeless_and_changeless.html

[Christians4LessGvt]

the U.S's position in Lebanon was comparable to our position in post war Germany,
and post war South Korea?

I never stated the situations were the same or comparable.
What I did say in response to XO's question was
we should stay "for as long as it takes" as we have sometimes done elsewhere.
The point being...we should never "cut and run" right after an attack.
It sends the wrong message to an enemy.

You see stuff like this and it's so far afield that there's no point in trying to communicate
with the source.

You are quite welcome to ignore my posts in the future.

P.S. Happy Holidays

Since the word "holiday" comes from "Holy Day".....thanks BSB.
Happy Holy Days to you too!

[Xavier_Onassis]

So your theory is that because Reagan "cut and ran" in Beirut, that explains the frequent attacks on the US by Hezbollah?

Hezbollah may not like the US, but it has only taken action against Americans in Lebanon. Hezbollah did not cause 9-11, Hezbollah is not any sort of emboldened powerful enemy of the US.

History has clearly proven that Reagan sending troops to guard the Beirut airport was both futile and stupid, while getting the US out of Lebanon was wise and prudent. According to sirs, the removal of those few Marines was proof that Reagan was not "perfect". This is balderdash.

It has had no significant impact on anti-American actions in the 30 years that followed.

[Plane]

  On why Terroristic attacks on Americans is a good idea.


http://www.mattfarina.com/2006/11/12/a_quote_to_think_about

"We have seen in the last decade the decline of the American government and the weakness of the American soldier, who is ready to wage cold wars and unprepared to fight long wars. This was proven in Beirut when the Marines fled after two explosions. It also proves they can run in less than 24 hours, and this was also repeated in Somolia.... After a few blows, [the Americans] ran in defeat.... They forgot about being the world leader and the leader of the new order. [They] left, dragging their corpses and their shameful defeat." -- Osama bin Laden, ABC News interview, May 28, 1998

[Xavier_Onassis]

That actually proves nothing, other than Bin Laden was good at making propaganda. Did he plan 9-11 because of Beirut? Very doubtful. 9-11 was a response to the US stationing troops in Saudi Arabia, seen as against the Koran. The goal was to cause the US troops to be removed from Saudi Arabia, which actually happened,

Reagan was rarely wise, but withdrawing a few hundred troops from an indefensible position against the wishes of the Lebanese was a wise decision. They should never have been sent there.

[Plane]

Did Osama Bin Laden actually express satisfaction and stop any operations against the US when the Americans left Saudi Arabia?

   It is contrary to the Koran to give up any territory, he wanted Spain and Hungary back , and why stop there? The great heros of Islam are world conquring zelots, Osama also said that peace with the US required no more than a mass conversion to Islam on the part of the US.

    Why disbelieve him?

     Reagan was trying to help in Lebanon, not trying to gain anything, so he didn't feel so invested when we were so badly hurt in the barracks bombing, but pulling out was a mistake because it suggested to Osama and many others that the method for getting what they wanted from Americans was to hurt us .

     It might have been beter to have taken some revenge on the Hezbolla , or to harden our hearts and never assisted the Lebaneese, but of these three possibilitys the worst was to move weakly in and move weakly out again.

[Xavier_Onassis]

Reagan was a fool thy send the Marines in. Pulling them out was simply undoing a dumb mistake.
It did not cause 9-11.
The Muslims never took Hungary.

[Christians4LessGvt]

Did Osama Bin Laden actually express satisfaction and stop any operations against
the US when the Americans left Saudi Arabia?

Hell no he didnt he didnt stop any actions against the US.
Thats the fallacy of the Left...
As if we do this or that the IslamoWhackjobs will somehow go away.

[Xavier_Onassis]

The issue is not that they will go away, The issue is that they never would have managed to find people fanatical enough to go on suicide missions without the provocation of stationing troops in Saudi Arabia against the dictates of the Koran AND allowing some of those troops and/or their spouses to pass out Bibles in Arabic there.

[Plane]

Reagan was a fool thy send the Marines in. Pulling them out was simply undoing a dumb mistake.
It did not cause 9-11.
The Muslims never took Hungary.

I am afaraid that none of your statements are facticious.

the 9th century. Their first settlement was pillaged by the Mongols in 1241-42.[13] The re-established town became one of the centres of Renaissance humanist culture[14] in the 15th century.[15] Following the Battle of Mohács and nearly 150 years of Ottoman rule,[16]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest

[Christians4LessGvt]

The issue is not that they will go away, The issue is that they never would have managed to find
people fanatical enough to go on suicide missions without the provocation

You dont get it...
Nothing short of surrender and sharia law will stop suicide missions
MuslimWhackjobs are blowing up non-Muslim people up across the globe
that never had a troop in Saudi Arabia...that argument is a sham.

Geert Wilders' Warning to America

[Plane]

  Reagan was extremely intelligent, but he was not perfect.

   Beiruit would have been a mess with or without the Marines trying to help, was it even worth the try?
     If there had been a barrier built to prevent the suicide bombers from killing the French and American soldiers, there might have been a little bit of progress going upstream in that avelanche.

     We were wrong  in the way we did it and wrong in the way we left , it would have been better to not have even tried , hind sight makes this easy to see.

      But the mistakes Reagan made were the mistakes of nobility not stupidity, the imperfection that tripped Reagan up this time was his soft heart.

[BSB]

The biggest mistake in Lebanon was made the Marine commander that bunched all those Marines together and left them barely protected. Incredibly stupid. One of the first rules of a Marine, or Army, combat unit, no matter how big or small, is to never bunch up so that one mortar, one grenade, one of whatever the enemy is tossing around will get all of you. If you're vulnerable to attack that is the first thing any NCO, or officer, will correct if they observe that the rule isn't being obeyed. The first thing.

Lebanon: While leaving Lebanon became grist for bin Ladens mill, there was no reason to stay really. This was 1983, there was no Al Qaeda, bin Laden was either working for us or about to, the Gulf War was years away, and so forth.

Further, bin Laden was dead wrong. Most of the world was reading us wrong starting from our exit from Vietnam. Sure, we left Vietnam, but we had stayed for a very long time, and spent a lot of blood and treasure. No other military in the world could have spent that much time, at the end of an equally long supply line, with constantly dwindling civilian support, and no palpable reason for the soldiers to go on, and put up that kind of a fight. They talk about how tough the VC were, or how tough the Mujahideen are, please, they fight on their home turf, or with religious convection, while we fight dangling from the end of a rope.

So, sure you can make the case that leaving Lebanon was a mistake. You could also make the case that they took the bait, whether the hook was purposely baited or not.

BSB