Author Topic: 1st amendment follies  (Read 4345 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
1st amendment follies
« on: September 09, 2014, 05:24:00 PM »
While some would try to argue that the importance about the 2nd amendment is nothing more than talking about guns, the issue of an even more important freedom, that of the right to free expression, as blanketed by the 1st amendment is finding a not so pleasant taste in some Senate Democrats in DC, who wanted to fast track a NEW amendment to the Constitution, giving Government greater ability to regulate and restrict what people could say using their 1st amendment right.

It gets even more humerous.  Apparently, the effort by Senate Democrats was to bring this amendment up for a vote, with the expectation of the GOP to filibuster the effort....that way they could march out to the microphones with preplanned talking points, along the lines of These Republicans are obstructing votes in order to protect millionaires and billionaires, like the Koch's, who are poisoning our politics with filthy outside money!

So what DID the GOP do?  Well, enough Republicans said, sure, let's open it up to debate.  So instead of filibusting, the GOP called Reid's bluff to open the topic up for the whole Senate.  NOW the Democrats are whining that they have to debate on a topic, as important as the 1st amendment, taking away prescious podium time that they'd be using to lament minimum wage and income disparity

Priceless
« Last Edit: September 09, 2014, 08:22:04 PM by sirs »
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2014, 05:57:32 PM »
Everything to sirs is priceless.

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2014, 06:04:30 PM »
Not everything, but you could definitely say I consider freedom, the Bill of Rights, and the Constitution of the U.S. priceless
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2014, 10:44:28 PM »
    Irony is best when unintended.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2014, 12:35:58 PM »
What about "freedom isn't free"

How does that jibe with "freedom is priceless".

Perhaps you are aware that this is NOT the country rated as freest in the world. Lots of others have us beat, including Canada and Iceland.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2014, 12:56:22 PM »
What about "freedom isn't free"

That makes no sense.  When you're in prison, obviously you're not free,  When you could legally purchase X yesterday, but made illegal by Government the next day, you no longer have the freedom to buy X now, do you.  If you could legally partipate in Y today, but Government is legislating that Y will be made illegal, obviously the freedom to do Y is about to be usurped.


How does that jibe with "freedom is priceless".

Because that goes without explantion.  Freedom is priceless


Perhaps you are aware that this is NOT the country rated as freest in the world. Lots of others have us beat, including Canada and Iceland.

In very specific issues, possibly.  In the totality of freedom however, as highlighted in the Bill of Rights, not even close to the U.S.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2014, 06:26:58 PM by sirs »
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2014, 06:17:14 PM »
Finland is at the top of the list.

http://rsf.org/index2014/en-asia.php

The US is 43rd out of 190

In economic freedom, the US is 17th out of 45, according to the Cato Institute.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_Freedom_of_the_World

Who is number one?  Hong Kong! Who is second?  Singapore!

They must have not included the Freedom to Chew Gum and to throw it away irresponsibly,
« Last Edit: September 10, 2014, 06:28:09 PM by Xavier_Onassis »
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2014, 06:28:33 PM »
Again, based on what?  Does Finland have a comparable 2nd Amendment?
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2014, 06:31:07 PM »
Who gives a shit?

I know I don't. I know that hunting is popular in Finland.

Maybe there is a gun nut freedom index as well.

Guns are useful only for defending your freedom if your freedom is threatened.
The right to own a gun is rather like the right to chew gum if your freedom is not threatened, which I find to be the case in my life.

Again, the main reason for the 2nd Amendment was that in the South, the slaves needed to be repressed and returned to their owners, and in the West, people were threatened by bears, wolverines and hostile Indians (and others).
« Last Edit: September 10, 2014, 06:49:51 PM by Xavier_Onassis »
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2014, 06:56:27 PM »
Since you can't seem to answer either question,  apparently the US is a free-er country than even Finland.    8)
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2014, 08:17:35 PM »
  Finland has earned their freedom.

  WWII started early for them , and they had to fight the USSR.


   Yes, there are a lot of interesting stories about Finnish marksmanship.

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2014, 08:22:07 PM »
Again, based on what?  Does Finland have a comparable 2nd Amendment?

  I see what you are getting at.

    A lot of the rankings would change if you controlled the criteria.


      But if the US is halfway down the list of the most free, is this a problem? How much of this is a problem of government?

      If Hong Kong made the list at all, the criteria must be pretty twisty.

       And Singapore?

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2014, 09:29:57 PM »
Hong Kong is supposed to to be the easiest place to start a business.

I hardly think my ability to answer sirs stupid questions has even a teensy bit of bearing on the comparative freedom of the US and Finland.
But it does to sirs.

"it speaks VOLUMES!"

"Priceless!"
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2014, 09:46:34 PM »
Hong Kong is supposed to to be the easiest place to start a business.


That is certainly a freedom that we could improve here.

Xavier_Onassis

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27916
    • View Profile
Re: 1st amendment follies
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2014, 09:49:54 PM »
The main difficulty with starting a business is inexperience. People start businesses unaware that customers not space their visits conveniently. They come in swarms in December, and vanish in January.  There are dearths and spates and the rent on the space is the biggest hurdle.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."