But did he have an open carry certificate?

[Xavier_Onassis]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025448335

Gun nut gets blown away by a 9 year old he was teaching to use an Uzi.

[sirs]

What kind of an idiotic, completely unrelated question, is that??   

[Christians4LessGvt]

let's ban claw-hammers too! 

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/kendall-anderson-16-killed-mom-claw-hammer-playstation-court-article-1.139414

[sirs]

I'm still trying to grasp how one relates to the other....how the legal right to open carry in some locations is related to some fella who wasn't sharp enough to educate the proper safety & handling of a firearm??  A firearm not even logistically, or even legally be used in open carry, for that matter

[Xavier_Onassis]

According to one of the dippier gun nuts here, no one with an open carry certificate has ever been convicted of killing anyone.

I am pretty sure the 9 year old girl did not have one.

[sirs]

You're still making no sense.  No 9 year old is going to be given an open carry permit, much less an automatic weapon.  That's related to simply going around town with the right to carry a firearm.  Your article talks about an accident when someone was trying to instruct the 9 year old, poorly apparently, in how to use a semi-automatic firearm

So, I ask again, what does an apparently tragic accident have anything to do with open carry laws??

[Plane]

  This kind of accident can happen, in a large population it will certainly happen.

    Shooting range operators and instructors have to make especial effort to keep such accidents rare.



http://www.nssf.org/PDF/research/IIR_InjuryStatistics2013.pdf

Unintentional
Firearms Fatalities
at All-time Low
Data released by the National
Safety Council demonstrates that
unintentional firearm-related
fatalities continue to remain at
historically low levels. In fact, in
the last two decades the number
of unintentional firearm-related
fatalities has declined by 58 percent
– from 1,441 unintentional fatalities
in 1991 to 600* in 2011.
Firearms are involved in ½ percent
of all unintentional fatalities in the
United States. In a side-by-side
comparison, firearms rank among
the lowest causes of injury.

[sirs]

Also keep in mind, the millions of people in this country, who are legally allowed to carry a concealed weapon, compared to those killed by someone legally allowed to carry a concealed weapon

[Xavier_Onassis]

What sort of moron even allows a nine years old gir to touch a loaded Uzi?

It should be quite easy to make stupid crap like this not just rare, but utterly impossible.

[sirs]

What sort of moron even allows a nine years old gir to touch a loaded Uzi?

Anyone who safely handles firearms, and can educate said 9 year old in the proper handling and use of said firearm.  The moron would be the one that performs the above action, wrecklessly

It should be quite easy to make stupid crap like this not just rare, but utterly impossible.

And we can keep Airline accidents from ever occuring as well.....no more flying.  Oh, that means we can make car accidents utterly impossible.....no more driving

[Christians4LessGvt]

Just heard on the radio on my drive home
the instructor was not an NRA Certified Instrutor

[Xavier_Onassis]

Naturally, that makes all the difference in the world.

As a result, he will be resurrected, and the little girl's memory will be erased.
Naturally, the NRA would never DREAM of lying about this.

[sirs]

Naturally, that makes all the difference in the world.

As a result, he will be resurrected, and the little girl's memory will be erased.
Naturally, the NRA would never DREAM of lying about this.

Spoken with the greatest of ignorance, that can be demonstrated on a topic.  I mean, it's masterful.

On the one had, if this instructor wasn't NRA certified, the implication is the sarcastic shouldn't make a difference.  and then in the very next breath is added invalid implication that the NRA would lie about this, as if it should make a difference, if he were or not.  I mean which is it??

A) The NRA would NOT dream of this, because if it were determined that they had, their credibility would be severely degraded on future topics  (yea yea, the knee jerk response is that they have no credibility to begin with....based on of course, nothing but the poster's say so...no facts or evidence required.)

B) This instructor apparently did NOT safely instruct this 9 year old, as he did not position himself where it was safe, or make sure that the 9 year old could handle the recoil of the weapon

C) This issue has absolutely SQUAT to do with legal open or even concealed carry laws.  But leave it to the left to take a tragic accident, and try to push a political agenda with it.  Obama and Holder would be proud   

[sirs]

What sort of moron even allows a nine years old gir to touch a loaded Uzi?

Here's a 13year old, that was obviously taught how to touch one at a young age, probably earlier than 9.  Education is everything in firearm safety

[sirs]

What sort of moron even allows a nine years old gir to touch a loaded Uzi?

Monday's events were tragic and we extend a heart felt and sincere sympathy for the families involved. First and foremost a life was lost and with respect we want to clarify that Shyanne was NOT involved in this incident.

For those unaware a 9 year old New Jersey resident girl, under the direction of her parents and an instructor was in operation of a fully automatic Uzi. Events transpired that lead to the accidental (negligent) fatal shooting of her instructor.

We feel that situations like this are truly shameful, and through proper safety procedures are avoidable. Shyanne's father Dan weighs in with his daughter about this controversial subject in the article below.

I personally as an instructor who has taught dozens of children to shoot and countless adults, am taken back by the situation. I would never allow the operation of a fully automatic firearm by ANYONE child or adult, without the proper training and experience.

My experience is primarily with semi automatic and standard manual action firearms. I always start with ONE round in the gun, and I can't emphasize enough the importance of ensuring that an individual of any age demonstrates control and responsibility with each firearm, each caliber, each situation, as they progress in training. Follow the ONE round rule as you introduce new shooters. An empty firearm dropped can not harm anyone, starting with a single round ensures the safety of everyone involved. Work your way up, this is not about shock and awe, this is about safety and responsibility.

Additional - touch is OK - I stay on top of someone and position them, the firearm, and police the situation. Let me make it simple, if you are not comfortable with me touching you and/or your child to ensure their safety then I am not comfortable with any of you touching my guns. The situation is professional and shall remain entirely as such, an instructor is responsible for the entire situation and for every round that leaves the barrel. This trumps anyone's feelings about how one should not touch someone to provide needed support and direction.

Changing subjects a bit ... I have been up close to Shy when she is shooting. I am right there, getting personal to get the drama and capture the moments. I want to say we produce these photos and videos with very careful practice. We have RSO's spotting the shooter and the camera operators. We have practiced this dry fire before we go live fire. We are all following the 180 rules, and I most certainly get scolded by the RSO assigned to spot me and ensure I don't get optics blinders and wander into the line of fire. When you see a shot from the front of a live shooter, the camera is on a tripod or positioned away from people and operated by remote control. While we may risk our equipment, we will never risk our lives for an image.

Again, take a moment of reflection for those who were hurt this week. Let us all qualify our reactions with maturity and take every logical and responsible action to prevent this from ever happening again. We are the ones who hold dear our liberty, and the right to protect it. We must adhere to the responsibility this right bears on us to behave in a manner respectful of the power we hold in our hands when we grip a firearm.

Eric Roberts