Author Topic: 150 Weapons  (Read 7665 times)

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BSB

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2013, 03:25:43 PM »
People like Gen McCrystal don't think it should be banned because of how it looks moron. It should be banned because of it's capabilities. And that's right Sirs, there is nothing in the constitution that says you can't ban the AR15s.   

You're O for two. Sirs the gun-nut that's all nut and no gun.


BSB


sirs

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #16 on: January 29, 2013, 03:32:04 PM »
People like Gen McCrystal & yourself apparently don't have the gonads to apparently ban semiautomatics, and instead play like they care and just ban the ones that look nastier than others.  A semiautomatic, is a semiautomatic, is a semiautomatic.  It's capabilities are equal to pretty much every other magazine fed semiautomatic

O for two?  LOL  That's what emotion can do, it would appear.  Turn rational thought into some twisted rationalization train
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

BSB

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #17 on: January 29, 2013, 03:51:04 PM »
Look Sirs, you're as out of it on this as you are on your claim that talking to someone in a car, with you, while driving, is the same as talking to someone on a phone while you're driving. You're as out of it on this as you are on global warming. You're just plane out of it Sirs. Out to lunch. Living in self-imposed intellectual exile. Talking to you is like talking to a Taliban cleric about Darwin. There is no hope for you whatsoever.


BSB   

sirs

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2013, 04:10:47 PM »
LOL...oh the irony....especially the no hope part.  Please let us know when you plan on putting some substance to the emotion by advocating the ban of all semiautomatics.  Then you MIGHT have a credible leg to stand on, with your know-it-all proclamations
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

sirs

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #19 on: January 29, 2013, 04:22:56 PM »
So now that BsB & Sirs have finished this song and dance insult routine, can we please get back to some serious discussions, minus the demeaning slurs and insults
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #20 on: January 29, 2013, 04:40:51 PM »
That is pretty much all there is to it.

Sirs emits bogus "facts" and then claims that anyone who does not believe them is wrong.

Rinse and repeat.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

sirs

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #21 on: January 29, 2013, 04:44:19 PM »
You'll have to point out what bogus facts those would be, and how they are "bogus".  Your say so, just doesn't cut it, I'm afraid
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #22 on: January 29, 2013, 10:06:42 PM »
What is the real reason to register all guns and  gun owners?

===============================================
Public safety, of course. The Swiss register every gun and every piece of ammo in the country and have been doing so for a century or so.  The murder rate in Switzerland is a fraction of what it is here,and the Swiss are doing what the 2nd Amendment states: serving as members of a well-organized militia. Swiss who own guns are required to undergo training about how to use their guns. I have not heard that the Swiss government has become oppressive of the rights of the Swiss people in the past 300 years.

Somehow registering guns and their owners has worked out just fine for the Swiss. It is likely that the Nazis and the Fascists made no attempts to conquer Switzerland precisely because of the Swiss militia and the elaborate plans that the Swiss had to repel attack.

Every Swiss man knows that misuse of his gun or his ammo will have serious consequences. I have not heard of a single incident of massacres like we have every year in the US occurring in Switzerland.

Don't the Swiss also have fewer murders (per capata) with hammers? They have few hammer murders because hammers are registered?

Massive massicres by madmen are rare in every country , only the big countrys have more than a few in their history, Norway had none at all untill they had the biggest one of all.


I like this article for its charts , some of the conclusions he reaches at the end of the article I do not agree with , but for a liberal, he has a remarkably well thought out position and willingness to find compromise.
I provide excerpts necessacery to understand these charts , but the whole article at the link is worth reading.

http://www.neontommy.com/news/2012/07/doing-math-guns
Quote
What makes a Nigerian gun more dangerous than a Swedish gun?







Killers in countries where civilians tend to be armed show a slight preference for guns but just as in the first scatter plot, gun ownership and murder rates show no relationship. Swiss and American murderers use guns simply because they’re around. South Korean and British murderers don’t have a pistol in the closet so they take a knife from the drawer. Either way, killers gonna kill.

.......................................
There is indeed a strong correlation between murder rates and socio-economic development, which is even more striking considering the measurement used. Murders per gun is a metric that isolates the impact of gun ownership on the murder rate: someone who believes many civilian guns almost always lead to many homicides per capita and few to few would expect the green bars to be relatively flat, and not necessarily aligned with the kind of factors measured in the Human Development Index, things like poverty and failing institutions. This is obviously not the case at all.

sirs

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2013, 10:11:29 PM »
WOW....great graphs, Plane.  Nice facts    8)
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #24 on: January 29, 2013, 10:16:38 PM »
WOW....great graphs, Plane.  Nice facts    8)

I should only have credit for searching for them with Google.

The Author of that article must have done some serious work producing them.

sirs

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #25 on: January 29, 2013, 10:53:04 PM »
Seriously
"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #26 on: January 29, 2013, 11:20:49 PM »


Maybe he is wrong , that kind of thing happens , even to me.

What is the real reason to register all guns and  gun owners?


You,... Wrong?


What a wierd thought.

The registration of guns is not to prevent massicres .

Imagine that all the guns used by the perpetrators of the Columbine , Fort Dix and Sandy Hook atrositys were better registered, in any way that you can imagine registering them .

There would be no effect. The guys that did this stuff didn't even plan a getaway, let alone plan a second occurance. What does knowing more about the origin of the wepon found on scene do about this?

The registration idea is seriously debunked in Canada, where the extreme and impractical and expensive registration of all guns was abandoned mid-program, it was in the execution that the people realised that it was irritateing much more than it was effective , expensive and dangerous much more than it was liable to save anyone injury.

If it failed spectacularly in Canada , how could it work in the US which has two orders of magnitude more guns involved?

Plane

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #27 on: January 29, 2013, 11:41:41 PM »
Quote
The legislation strengthens the 1994 Assault Weapons Ban and state bans by:

Moving from a 2-characteristic test to a 1-characteristic test.
 
(The bill also makes the ban harder to evade by eliminating the easy-to-remove bayonet mounts and flash suppressors from the characteristics test.)
http://www.ibtimes.com/dianne-feinstein-gun-bill-text-list-guns-banned-details-assault-weapons-ban-2013-1037402
So we are going to loose everything with a pistol grip and , or thumbhole stock?

I won't really miss the grenade launcher, but the bayonette being gone will completely block me from comitting any crimes.

Plane

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #28 on: January 29, 2013, 11:49:00 PM »
In addition to any rifle that can mount a bayonette this list is specificly banned by name in the proposed law.

For no apparent reason.



http://www.ibtimes.com/dianne-feinstein-gun-bill-text-list-guns-banned-details-assault-weapons-ban-2013-1037402
Quote
List of Firearms Prohibited by Name

Rifles: All AK types, including the following: AK, AK47, AK47S, AK–74, AKM, AKS, ARM, MAK90, MISR, NHM90, NHM91, Rock River Arms LAR–47, SA85, SA93, Vector Arms AK–47, VEPR, WASR–10, and WUM, IZHMASH Saiga AK, MAADI AK47 and ARM, Norinco 56S, 56S2, 84S, and 86S, Poly Technologies AK47 and AKS; All AR types, including the following: AR–10, AR–15, Armalite M15 22LR Carbine, Armalite M15–T, Barrett REC7, Beretta AR–70, Bushmaster ACR, Bushmaster Carbon 15, Bushmaster MOE series, Bushmaster XM15, Colt Match Target Rifles, DoubleStar AR rifles, DPMS Tactical Rifles, Heckler & Koch MR556, Olympic Arms, Remington R–15 rifles, Rock River Arms LAR–15, Sig Sauer SIG516 rifles, Smith & Wesson M&P15 Rifles, Stag Arms AR rifles, Sturm, Ruger & Co. SR556 rifles; Barrett M107A1; Barrett M82A1; Beretta CX4 Storm; Calico Liberty Series; CETME Sporter; Daewoo K–1, K–2, Max 1, Max 2, AR 100, and AR 110C; Fabrique Nationale/FN Herstal FAL, LAR, 22 FNC, 308 Match, L1A1 Sporter, PS90, SCAR, and FS2000; Feather Industries AT–9; Galil Model AR and Model ARM; Hi-Point Carbine; HK–91, HK–93, HK–94, HK–PSG–1 and HK USC; Kel-Tec Sub–2000, SU–16, and RFB; SIG AMT, SIG PE–57, Sig Sauer SG 550, and Sig Sauer SG 551; Springfield Armory SAR–48; Steyr AUG; Sturm, Ruger Mini-14 Tactical Rife M–14/20CF; All Thompson rifles, including the following: Thompson M1SB, Thompson T1100D, Thompson T150D, Thompson T1B, Thompson T1B100D, Thompson T1B50D, Thompson T1BSB, Thompson T1–C, Thompson T1D, Thompson T1SB, Thompson T5, Thompson T5100D, Thompson TM1, Thompson TM1C; UMAREX UZI Rifle; UZI MiniCarbine, UZI Model A Carbine, and UZI Model B Carbine; Valmet M62S, M71S, and M78; Vector Arms UZI Type; Weaver Arms Nighthawk; Wilkinson Arms Linda Carbine.
 
Pistols: All AK–47 types, including the following: Centurion 39 AK pistol, Draco AK–47 pistol, HCR AK–47 pistol, IO Inc. Hellpup AK–47 pistol, Krinkov pistol, Mini Draco AK–47 pistol, Yugo Krebs Krink pistol; All AR–15 types, including the following: American Spirit AR–15 pistol, Bushmaster Carbon 15 pistol, DoubleStar Corporation AR pistol, DPMS AR–15 pistol, Olympic Arms AR–15 pistol, Rock River Arms LAR 15 pistol; Calico Liberty pistols; DSA SA58 PKP FAL pistol; Encom MP–9 and MP–45; Heckler & Koch model SP-89 pistol; Intratec AB–10, TEC–22 Scorpion, TEC–9, and TEC–DC9; Kel-Tec PLR 16 pistol; The following MAC types: MAC–10, MAC–11; Masterpiece Arms MPA A930 Mini Pistol, MPA460 Pistol, MPA Tactical Pistol, and MPA Mini Tactical Pistol; Military Armament Corp. Ingram M–11, Velocity Arms VMAC; Sig Sauer P556 pistol; Sites Spectre; All Thompson types, including the following: Thompson TA510D, Thompson TA5; All UZI types, including: Micro-UZI.
 
Shotguns: Franchi LAW–12 and SPAS 12; All IZHMASH Saiga 12 types, including the following: IZHMASH Saiga 12, IZHMASH Saiga 12S, IZHMASH Saiga 12S EXP–01, IZHMASH Saiga 12K, IZHMASH Saiga 12K–030, IZHMASH Saiga 12K–040 Taktika; Streetsweeper; Striker 12.
 

Plane

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Re: 150 Weapons
« Reply #29 on: January 30, 2013, 12:00:09 AM »
People like Gen McCrystal & yourself apparently don't have the gonads to apparently ban semiautomatics, and instead play like they care and just ban the ones that look nastier than others.  A semiautomatic, is a semiautomatic, is a semiautomatic.  It's capabilities are equal to pretty much every other magazine fed semiautomatic

O for two?  LOL  That's what emotion can do, it would appear.  Turn rational thought into some twisted rationalization train

    There is a lot of diffrence in quality and capability between one and another wepon.

      Despite this quibble , I agree with your basic premise , in that all of them are hugely dangerous to the unarmed.

     Even the least effective , lowest quality ones.