The State of Englishness

[Universe Prince]

Brilliant reply.

Better and nicer than deserved by "being a racist is ok. Can't help it." Apparently those arguments you cannot argue against you oversimplify and then ridicule the oversimplification. Bravo. To that, "pooh yi" is indeed a brilliant reply. A stupid reply would be to try to explain the actual argument again.

[BT]

The actual argument is that society is racist because historically it has been racist. It doesn't matter one bit whether individuals who make up that society are racist or not The group association sticks.

So why go against the flow. Why bother. Just surrender to that which you can not control. It's in our DNA, We are victims, it's an illness just as if we had diabetes.

Mikey says racism is zipcode specific. Both you and JS say racism can't be cured in this lifetime, in this generation, or in this moment.

To be honest i don't buy any of the above arguments. Racism ends when individuals are no longer racist. And that change happens one person at a time. And there is no required duration or waiting period  for that change.

[Universe Prince]

The actual argument is that society is racist because historically it has been racist. It doesn't matter one bit whether individuals who make up that society are racist or not The group association sticks.

Pooh yi. Yes, by all means, just make up nonsense, denounce the nonsense and claim intellectual victory. You win! Bravo! Best debate ever. Congratulations on a job well done.

[BT]

You can stick your sarcasm up your ass for all i care.

Meanwhile what part of my summary was incorrect.

[Universe Prince]

You can stick your sarcasm up your ass for all i care.

Nah. I figure you can stick it in your pipe and smoke it, Mr. "I am beginning to get the impression that being a racist is ok."

Meanwhile what part of my summary was incorrect.

Hey, that looks like a question. The actual argument is not that society is racist regardless of the individuals in it. The actual argument that there is racism in the culture because the culture has been shaped in part by a history that has included racism both institutionalized and at the individual level. I hesitate to speak for JS, but I'm pretty sure he is not saying everyone in society is racist. And I know for a fact that I'm not saying that at all. So basically, the parts of your summary that were incorrect were the beginning, the middle and the end.

[BT]

In your travels what percentage of people that you have encountered would you consider  racist?

Do you consider the people you met participants and or shapers of american culture.

Is the culture of a people fluid or static?

[Universe Prince]

Ah, I had a feeling we'd get to the Socratic questions eventually.

In your travels what percentage of people that you have encountered would you consider  racist?

I've encountered many people, and few of them have I gotten to know well enough to say whether or not they were racist, so I am not in a position to fairly answer that question.

Do you consider the people you met participants and or shapers of american culture.

Yes.

We are born into a world we have not made. The culture exists before we arrive as individuals. Yes, individuals contribute to the culture and shape it, but they are also shaped by it. We grow up in the culture, shaped by the culture at least as much as we contribute to it. We who have grown up here in the U.S. are shaped in part by the culture that exists here in the U.S. Do you deny this?

Is the culture of a people fluid or static?

I have to address this again? Okay, one more time: yes, the culture can and does change, and no one said that it cannot or does not. Whether or not the culture can change has never been the issue. By now we should all have noted that we all agree the culture can change. So can we now please move on past that pointless part of the discussion? Thanks.

[BT]

Ah, I had a feeling we'd get to the Socratic questions eventually.

If you aren't up to providing clarification let me know.

I've encountered many people, and few of them have I gotten to know well enough to say whether or not they were racist, so I am not in a position to fairly answer that question.

Nice dodge, of those you know well enough, what percentage?

We are born into a world we have not made. The culture exists before we arrive as individuals. Yes, individuals contribute to the culture and shape it, but they are also shaped by it. We grow up in the culture, shaped by the culture at least as much as we contribute to it. We who have grown up here in the U.S. are shaped in part by the culture that exists here in the U.S. Do you deny this?

Since our culture is racist and we are shaped by our culture, we are therefore racist.

Is that the gist of what you are saying?

If it is what was so god awful about me saying we should accept who we are. I can no more change the fact that i am german irish than you can change the fact that you are sarcastic. It's the nature of the beast.


 

[Universe Prince]

If you aren't up to providing clarification let me know.

I'm more than up to it. And quite willing to do so most of the time, as I think my record here proves. The question is not whether I am up to providing clarification. The question is whether you're going to pay attention or just stick to making up nonsense.

Nice dodge, of those you know well enough, what percentage?

Was that a dodge? Well, you would know. Anyway, given that I have never attempted to quantify this in any way, I'll have to guess at an answer. My guess would be probably 15 to 25%.

Since our culture is racist and we are shaped by our culture, we are therefore racist.

Is that the gist of what you are saying?

No. When you're ready to pay attention, let me know.

[BT]

No. When you're ready to pay attention, let me know.

I did,

Did you not say our culture was racist?

[Universe Prince]

No, I did not.

[BT]

If our culture is not racist, then what is the problem?

[Universe Prince]

See, you're not paying attention.

[kimba1]

sigh
but what do you about(racism) it?
look it I`ll say racism is bad ,but I brought up complaining about it isn`t exactly helping .
I`ll also point out people are racist about thier very own race.
ex. despite what said african amercicans do say the n-word with the exact negative meaning.

[Universe Prince]

sigh
but what do you about(racism) it?

You don't participate in it. You try to teach other people that it is wrong. Some folks will listen. Some won't.