Author Topic: Cain on Foreign Policy  (Read 42639 times)

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Xavier_Onassis

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #150 on: November 06, 2011, 12:25:26 PM »
My observation is that whenever a politician clams up about something and does not get his side of the story out, it has ALWAYS been because his side of the story is pretty awful, worse than most have imagined. Gary Hart, Spiro Agnew, Richard Nixon, John Edwards. It is a nonpartisan phenomenon. Imagine, a Black guy and a White woman who must have the Southern vote. How would that work out?

Sure, it is speculation. So is my opinion of who will get the nomination.

I can say what I wish. You can believe whatever pulls your chain.

I think Debkafiles sucks. Some think that is is the Word of Gawd Awmighty.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

BT

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #151 on: November 06, 2011, 01:48:13 PM »
Quote
Well, it WOULD be if your ludicrous theory that the GOP favours black interests had any merit.  As it happens, it is YOUR theory that the blacks would benefit from a GOP administration that is utter nonsense.

The GOP treats everyone equally. I think that was clarified during one of the debates when the hispanic journalist asked what the GOP would do to pander to that demographic and the answer from all the panelists was nothing.

Now what have the dems done for blacks recently to earn their vote. Can't be much if the Black Caucus accuses Obama of taking their votes for granted.


BSB

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #152 on: November 06, 2011, 03:48:34 PM »
As a meeting, on the heels of 9/11, was about to begin at Camp David, Tony Blair noticed that Bush was flanked by two African Americans, Colin Powell, and Condi Rice. Blair thought, could this happen in the UK? No, he answered himself, we aren't this far along.

Neither is any other western European nation. And only the United States, among the western powers, has elected an African-you-pick-it as their leader.

Find another horse to ride, Blowhard.

BSB (A Republican who voted for an African American to lead this country)


Kramer

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #153 on: November 06, 2011, 03:59:02 PM »
As a meeting, on the heels of 9/11, was about to begin at Camp David, Tony Blair noticed that Bush was flanked by two African Americans, Colin Powell, and Condi Rice. Blair thought, could this happen in the UK? No, he answered himself, we aren't this far along.

Neither is any other western European nation. And only the United States, among the western powers, has elected an African-you-pick-it as their leader.

Find another horse to ride, Blowhard.

BSB (A Republican who voted for an African American to lead this country)

Canada too.

BSB

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #154 on: November 06, 2011, 04:42:40 PM »
This conversation, because beyond its entertainment, and personal ego trip, value, is meaningless. A white minority in this country is only just around the corner. It's the not the Smiths and the Jones who live down the street anymore, it's the Alaminos family, and the Sanchez family.



BSB


Michael Tee

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #155 on: November 06, 2011, 06:11:56 PM »
Blair is a whore who joined in the unprovoked war on Iraq and not content with following the lies that Bush made up to justify the criminal action, actually made up his own lies as well.  (Google Downing Street Memo.)  His fawning comments to War Criminal Bush about America's "racial progress" are about as honest and sincere as anything else he says.

For those who are stupid enough to be taken in by Bush's little Afro-American dog & pony show, let me help you out a little here:  the use of Uncle Toms and Aunt Jemimas aren't intended to appeal to the white racist segment of the GOP, who are already hooked on policies, not appearances, and understand all too well what the Willie Hortons and "welfare queens" really signify.  The Toms and Jemimas are for the non-racist uncommitted whites and some very few, very dumb blacks, who are likely to be lulled by the imagery into joining or voting GOP when an overtly racist party might have turned them right off.

That said, I have to admit that there has been considerable racial progress in America during my own lifetime, from the days of lynch law and Jim Crow in the South to the days of Condi and General Powell.  Could any Canadian government show a similar public acceptance of blacks at the highest levels of government?  IMHO, probably not and probably not for a long time.  Credit where credit is due, and all that.  I am crediting the Democratic Party under the leadership of LBJ for the lion's share of that progress.  I don't think LBJ was very enthusiastic about doing it, but he recognized the need and he did what had to be done. 

BT

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #156 on: November 06, 2011, 06:54:07 PM »
Quote
That said, I have to admit that there has been considerable racial progress in America during my own lifetime, from the days of lynch law and Jim Crow in the South to the days of Condi and General Powell.

Except for those of the left who think they know the best course of thought for American Blacks and if these blacks deviate they are scorned with racial slurs.

Kramer

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #157 on: November 06, 2011, 07:19:24 PM »
BSB (A Republican who voted for an African American to lead this country)

A dumb reason to vote for anybody. Your right to vote should be revoked for such stupidity. Oh well, that's why every black person voted for him too.

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #158 on: November 06, 2011, 07:43:37 PM »
That is an excellent article on Gingrich. He has always seemed like a shameless opportunist to me, and this tends to back it up.

I didn't vote for Obama because he is Black, I voted for him because he was superior to McCain, and he still is. He is also superior to Gingrich.

I would have also voted for Hillary had she been the Democratic candidate. I had great respect for her in 2008 and greater respect now. She as been an excellent Secretary of State.
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Kramer

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #159 on: November 06, 2011, 08:10:23 PM »
She as been an excellent Secretary of State.

In what way as she been an excellent Sec of State?

Watching SEALs at the White House

Xavier_Onassis

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #160 on: November 06, 2011, 08:22:19 PM »
In every way, except in nor reading the riot act to Netanyahu.

What sort of clown would McCain have appointed?
"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

Kramer

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #161 on: November 06, 2011, 08:24:34 PM »
In every way, except in nor reading the riot act to Netanyahu.

What sort of clown would McCain have appointed?

If he were smart it would have been John Bolton.

Michael Tee

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #162 on: November 06, 2011, 08:25:11 PM »
plane:

<<First of all Clinton was not accused of giving women what they asked for, he was accused of lewdly exposing himself and lewd harrassment. His trial that "aquitted " him is where he admittedly committed purjury, which in my estimation puts a rotten spot on the aquittal.>>

The topic is Herman Cain and his fitness to be the GOP's Presidential candidate in 2012.  Can you explain how Clinton's past actions (two of which the House didn't even pass on to the Senate and two of which the Senate found him guilty of nothing) relate in any way to Cain's fitness to hold office?

All four allegations against Clinton were submitted to the proper fora and dismissed.  NONE of Cain's actions were submitted to any forum and the only investigation of them remains buried.  Common sense applied to what facts are available, tells us that he was in fact guilty as charged - - he was gone from office within two or maximum three months of the first claim being filed, there were two separate complainants and a third who did not file formally, his story about the events has changed several times since the matter came up and, contrary to his earlier claims, the total settlement value was about 80K, a fairly hefty settlement where no physical contact occurred and no substantial harm was alleged.  On the settlement that Bennett's client obtained, TWO lawyers for the Association signed, in addition to Bennett and his client.  The inclusion of a non-disparagement clause indicates that the Association did in fact undertake to look after the old Hermster's interests, which makes it all but impossible for Herm the Perv NOT to have signed some kind of authorization approving the settlement, lodged either with the Association or its insurers, depending on who assumed responsibility for dealing with the claim in the first place.

Contrary to what you have written, Clinton has NEVER admitted to perjury, nor has any legal representative authorized to represent him at any time.

<<Herman Cain is not even accused of half so much , and not by half so many.>>

Clinton's impeachment arose out of litigation dealing with the Paula Jones accusations, in which Clinton made statements regarding his affair with Monica.  I count two accusers.  Cain was formally charged by two female employees and a third had also alleged sexual harassment without formally filing a complaint.  That makes three.  Cain's three accusers cover a relatively short period of time within which he served as the NRA's CEO.  The accusations against Clinton span a much wider time frame, from his Governorship of Arkansas to the end of his second Presidential term of office.

     <<Most of what you wrote depends on assumptions on the competance, professionalism , honesty and common sense of the US business class , which I just don't share with you.>>

How ironic.  In all your other posts, you praise to the skies the expertise of private enterprise and exalt its vast superiority in doing anything that government can do.  According to your cockamamie theorizing, the investigation of a private-enterprise entity like the NRA ought to be vastly superior to any effort made by the FBI, CIA, DC District Police, Homeland Security or any other arm of the government.  But here you are, wracked with doubt over the ability of the ability of private enterprise to conduct a simple he-said-she-said investigation and come to any sensible conclusions about it.

plane, let me reassure you.  The investigation of these claims is not rocket science.  They are more common than you would like to think.  There is no physical evidence to be examined and analyzed, no stains on blue dresses.  There are no documents to be authenticated and then interpreted  and explained.  It is a simple he-says-she-says kind of case - - videotaped interviews, signed statements to be obtained, maybe some photos of the locations, polygraphs perhaps and a little background investigation of the principal parties.  Something that any half-assed PI agency does every fucking day.  In all probability the old Hermster himself authorized the settlement for reasons previously given, two lawyers acting for the employer signed it, and to this day to my knowledge the employer has never repudiated the settlement or attacked its lawyers for incompetence, negligence, corruption or any other wrongful representation.  Herm the Perv's ass was out the door within two to three months (max) of the first claim being filed. 

In his later explanations of these events, the Perv first denied that any settlement had been reached, THEN acknowledged that he had known about an AGREEEEEEMENT, but not about any SETTLEMENT (and attempted to edify us on the tiny but apparently significant differences in meaning) then estimated the total amount at a few thousand bucks representing a few months' wages as severance pay and then conceded that the actual settlement had been about 80K for TWO claims.

Now, plane, there are only two ways that all this could have happened:

1.  Herm the Perv, though pure and innocent as the driven snow, had had the incredible bad luck to be accused, not just by one, but by TWO evil lying whores, by some unfortunate coincidence found on his company's payroll, backed up by a third evil lying whore, who had also found her way onto the payroll, of sexual harassment which was followed by the additional bad luck of an incredibly botched investigation perhaps undertaken by the boss's teenage nephew on summer vacation and overseen by at least TWO corporate counsel who were also total incompetents, morons or paid off by plaintiff's attorney Bennett, all of which resulted in an 80K settlement which the executives of the Association were just too evil or incompetent or stupid to see was a travesty, and he also lost his job as a result of this forest of evil, lies and incompetence that surrounded him.  OR

2.  The system functioned pretty much as intended, the women who courageously came forward and complained were honestly motivated by insult and resentment at Herm the Perv's persistent unwanted advances, an investigation was made by reasonably competent investigators, reviewed by two reasonably competent corporate counsel who made recommendations to the Association's board, which reviewed and with or without changes, approved the settlement in its final form, bit the bullet and paid the 80K and told The Perv to get his ass in gear and remove himself and his overheated pecker from their premises ASAP.

Now plane, nobody but God knows what really happened, but we mortals have to draw our conclusions as best we can from the known facts.  I tend to believe that whatever minor errors could have been committed along the way, and certainly in a human process one will find human error, that Scenario 2 is just a lot more probable than Scenario 1.  If I were to be shown any particular evidence pointing to major incompetence on the part of the Association's investigators, or its counsel, or its Board, then I might lean more towards Scenario 1.  If I had reason to believe that the complainants were women of bad character, money-driven lying whores, then I might be moved more towards Scenario 1.  If Cain had told one straight, consistent, accurate story from the beginning, I might be less attracted to Scenario 2.  But given all the known facts, Scenario 2 seems to be the only logical conclusion that would occur to sane, logical folk who are not ideologically driven right-wing fanatics.

Is Scenario 1 impossible?  Theoretically not, but to believe in it, one has to accept one improbability piled on another, piled on another, piled on another.  Everybody involved, except Herm the Perv, has to be lying, incompetent, stupid or corrupt.  Everybody.  The perfect storm.  But for Scenario 2 to occur, we only need ONE person to stand off the beaten path, and that's the old Hermster.  I'm not going to use the Occam's Razor argument here, though it might apply - - but all I am saying is that plane's theory of what happened just seems to require a "perfect storm" of evil, incompetence, ignorance and/or corruption that just makes it a million-to-one shot.

    << I think highly placed professional businessmen are just as liable to be craven and foolish as anyone elese, what they chose to do might be quite diffrent than a good decdision and might also be diffrent than what Herman Cain would do.>>

Don't you realize HOW MANY people would have to be "craven and foolish" as well as lying and dishonest in order for all this to add up to a sequence of complaints (by three victims,) investigation, review, deliberation and payment?  It's NOT a one-man snap decision, you know.

Besides, don't you also think that "highly placed professional businessmen"  (Cain for example) are just as liable to be horny and obnoxious as anyone else?

What's interesting to me is that, as a committed conservative ideologue, you can cling to the illusion of The Perv's innocence in the face of all known fact, logic and common sense.  It's like, "Don't confuse me with the facts, my mind's already made up."  Fact and logic really DO mean nothing at all to you people.  You'll go down with the ship.

Fortunately the American people seem to have a lot more common sense than you guys do, and the sexual harassment disclosures are already starting to push down the Perv's numbers considerably.  In here, I really do get the sense that the inmates have taken over the asylum, while back in the real world, it doesn't seem all that bad.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2011, 08:31:53 PM by Michael Tee »

BSB

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #163 on: November 06, 2011, 09:18:26 PM »
Yeah, Colin Powell, and Condi Rice, were part of a dog and pony show. Meaning they were there only because they were black and had no real qualifications. You couldn't make a more racist comment if you tried, Blowhard.

The black curtain of revenge shut all the light out of your life decades ago, Canadian.


BSB

Kramer

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Re: Cain on Foreign Policy
« Reply #164 on: November 06, 2011, 09:23:08 PM »
Michael

I gotta hand it to you. You give the most in-depth answers of anyone I know.