Author Topic: Targeting militias  (Read 17465 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2007, 05:23:31 PM »
It is called "beating a dead horse."

Honest difference of opinion is stimulating, Irrationality is depressing. :-)

Hahahahaha

Did you know what the 3DHS was named for?

This is the Three Dead Horses Saloon!

If you ask BT politely he might show you our old logo  which featured horse skulls.

Irrationality , is a valued part of my life , I deal with it as a sort of humor or art.

Irrationality has in common with beauty that it is often in the eye of the beholder.

And is often beheld reciprocally!

I am only just humble enough to remember that I have been wrong before , and the illusions I knew then were no less convinceing than the ones my opposite members labor below now , supposeing I am right this time.

Amianthus

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7574
  • Bring on the flames...
    • View Profile
    • Mario's Home Page
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2007, 06:51:29 PM »
It is called "beating a dead horse."

Seen the name of the forum lately?
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2007, 11:52:32 PM »
<<MT, why place this in a religious context, e.g. Christians versus Muslims? Isn't this pandering to the side of irrationality. This conflcit, of whcih I never espoused, was and is NOT about religion at all. To place it in that context, only lets the radical militiais CONTROL the context and provide yet another reason to kill our troops over there. This conflict was and is about POWER.>>

I actually agree with you, Professor, that (a) this is not a religious conflict and (b) it is about power.

In answer to your question, (why place this in a religious context?) I was using a hypothetical example to make my point to plane.  My point was that the killing of American troops in Iraq was justified, that they had it coming.  To make the point, I asked plane to consider the situation from the POV of the people whose homeland was invaded and whose fellow citizens were killed - - I gave him the example of a foreign army invading America.  Wouldn't it be right for Americans to kill them?  To dramatize the point a bit, I used the example of a Muslim army, but for the purposes of my argument,  it could equally well have been a Communist army, an Arab army, a Jewish army, a Nazi army or a Polish army.  The real point I was making is that members of an invading army who invade other people's homelands should expect to be killed.  Sorry if I muddied the waters with the particular example I chose to make my point. 

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2007, 02:28:02 AM »
<<MT, why place this in a religious context, e.g. Christians versus Muslims? Isn't this pandering to the side of irrationality. This conflcit, of whcih I never espoused, was and is NOT about religion at all. To place it in that context, only lets the radical militiais CONTROL the context and provide yet another reason to kill our troops over there. This conflict was and is about POWER.>>

I actually agree with you, Professor, that (a) this is not a religious conflict and (b) it is about power.

In answer to your question, (why place this in a religious context?) I was using a hypothetical example to make my point to plane.  My point was that the killing of American troops in Iraq was justified, that they had it coming.  To make the point, I asked plane to consider the situation from the POV of the people whose homeland was invaded and whose fellow citizens were killed - - I gave him the example of a foreign army invading America.  Wouldn't it be right for Americans to kill them?  To dramatize the point a bit, I used the example of a Muslim army, but for the purposes of my argument,  it could equally well have been a Communist army, an Arab army, a Jewish army, a Nazi army or a Polish army.  The real point I was making is that members of an invading army who invade other people's homelands should expect to be killed.  Sorry if I muddied the waters with the particular example I chose to make my point. 

Where were you when Jefferson Davis needed you?

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2007, 11:46:02 PM »
<<Where were you when Jefferson Davis needed you?>>

I would have supported Jefferson Davis (much good it would have done him!) had he renounced slavery and racism, liberated blacks and enfranchised them and announced that he was fighting for the independence of a free, equal and anti-racist south.  Otherwise, fuck him and fuck the C.S.A.

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #20 on: February 12, 2007, 12:56:34 AM »
<<Where were you when Jefferson Davis needed you?>>

I would have supported Jefferson Davis (much good it would have done him!) had he renounced slavery and racism, liberated blacks and enfranchised them and announced that he was fighting for the independence of a free, equal and anti-racist south.  Otherwise, fuck him and fuck the C.S.A.


I doubt that you woud have been so demanding of him.

You seem to make no such demand of the inurgency we have been speaking of here.

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #21 on: February 12, 2007, 09:19:56 AM »
<<You seem to make no such demand of the inurgency we have been speaking of here.>>

I don't see the kind of moral disparity between the two sides here as I saw in the U.S. Civil War.  When one side is just fightng for oil and the other is defending what's rightfully theirs, I don't feel the need to impose further moral standards on the defenders.  When the fight is basically freedom versus slavery, the defenders of slavery had damn well better have something more to say for their cause than "Well I live here."

Amianthus

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7574
  • Bring on the flames...
    • View Profile
    • Mario's Home Page
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2007, 09:27:57 AM »
When the fight is basically freedom versus slavery, the defenders of slavery had damn well better have something more to say for their cause than "Well I live here."

So, how do you justify the northern states that continued slavery even after the Civil War ended?
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2007, 09:41:19 AM »
<<So, how do you justify the northern states that continued slavery even after the Civil War ended?>>

Wasn't even aware of them.  I presume the 14th amendment applied across the board and solved the entire problem fairly conclusively.  I never said that the north was perfect, only that there was a big disparity in the moral aims of both sides.

Amianthus

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7574
  • Bring on the flames...
    • View Profile
    • Mario's Home Page
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2007, 09:45:41 AM »
Wasn't even aware of them.  I presume the 14th amendment applied across the board and solved the entire problem fairly conclusively.  I never said that the north was perfect, only that there was a big disparity in the moral aims of both sides.

Yeah, I know you weren't aware of them, even though I pointed them out in this forum a number of times. You just ignore anything that doesn't fit into your preconceived notions.

The 14th Amendment had nothing to do with slavery. The 13th Amendment, which banned slavery, wasn't passed for a while after the war ended.
Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight. (Benjamin Franklin)

sirs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27078
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #25 on: February 12, 2007, 11:47:52 AM »
Wasn't even aware of them. ....

Yeah, I know you weren't aware of them, even though I pointed them out in this forum a number of times. You just ignore anything that doesn't fit into your preconceived notions.

Must fit the template...Bush is evil, American Military is Evil, Israel is evil, South is overwhelmingly racist, yada, rant, blather

"The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal." -- Aristotle

Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #26 on: February 12, 2007, 12:52:17 PM »
<<You seem to make no such demand of the inurgency we have been speaking of here.>>

I don't see the kind of moral disparity between the two sides here as I saw in the U.S. Civil War.  When one side is just fighting for oil and the other is defending what's rightfully theirs, I don't feel the need to impose further moral standards on the defenders.  When the fight is basically freedom versus slavery, the defenders of slavery had damn well better have something more to say for their cause than "Well I live here."

You show little familiarity with the goals of our opposition.
They are not eschewing slavery, not in any respect or form.

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2007, 01:29:34 PM »
Ami:  <<The 14th Amendment had nothing to do with slavery. >>

14th amendment had EVERYTHING to do with slavery.  It prevented discrimination against former slaves.  That was the whole point of it.

<<Section. 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. >>

plane:  <<You show little familiarity with the goals of our opposition.
They are not eschewing slavery, not in any respect or form.>>

What does slavery have to do with the current situation in Iraq?  The Iraqi Resistance is not planning to bring back slavery, and whatever form of tyrannical government the different factions espouse is already being supported in one form or another by the U.S.A. in Egypt, Jordan, Morocco and/or Saudi Arabia and Kuwait.  If you are trying to sell this as "democracy versus tyranny," you aren't going to find many buyers.


Plane

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26993
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #28 on: February 12, 2007, 01:35:10 PM »
The Iriqui Resistance is very likely to inlude as a goal the imposition of Shria law.
They do not forbid any form of slavery.

Michael Tee

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12605
    • View Profile
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: Targeting militias
« Reply #29 on: February 12, 2007, 01:40:42 PM »
<<The Iriqui Resistance is very likely to inlude as a goal the imposition of Shria law.
They do not forbid any form of slavery.>>

Well why wait for the Resistance to bring Sharia to Iraq?  We know for a fact it's already in Saudi Arabia.  I guess the U.S. should be invading Saudi Arabia now to stop slavery and Sharia.  I know how concerned they must be about it.